Suzuki allows up to 10% or e10 in all models. I use e10 because it keeps my tank dryer and cleaner. If I'm going to store the bike for more than two weeks, I use e10 with stabilizer. If more than a month, e0. If more than three months, e0 with fuel stabilizer. I never store a less than full tank.


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E10 actually attracts water.

Ethanol can causes problems

Because ethanol has an affinity for water, you need to be aware of the conditions in which you operate your equipment. Powersports and lawn & garden equipment should not be stored in damp or wet environments. When water is allowed to collect in the gas tank, the bond between ethanol and gasoline can break, causing a phenomenon known as phase separation.

The ethanol bonds with the water and sinks to the bottom of the fuel tank, which can create a whole host of problems, including the formation of gums, varnish and other insoluble debris that can plug fuel passages and negatively affect engine performance. When this ethanol/water mixture is pulled into the engine, it creates a lean-burn situation that increases combustion-chamber temperatures and can lead to engine damage. Once this happens there is no easy or inexpensive fix. To avoid these problems, contaminated fuel tanks should be emptied and refilled with fresh fuel.

Source: https://www.amsoil.com/newsstand/fuel-additives/articles/amsoil-quickshot/

 

Gasoline without ethanol is always better.

 

+1.

The only time my 650 has not had ethanol-free in it was when I took delivery at the dealership, and when traveling and unable to find it.

PS: I also run it in my truck, and in the wife's car. All of the power equipment (lawnmower, leaf blower, edger, etc) get ethanol free.

Yes, it costs a bit more, but with a view to power equipment repairs I've tracked the cost of ethanol free off and on for several years. My annual tune-up and repair costs are minimal, and I've never had a carburetor problem or general fuel systems issues with any of the power equipment.

 

For my V2, I run the E10 because it's convenient to get and I don't go much over a week without a fill up. For the wife's scooter that only gets gas every 3-4 months or so, I use the ethanol-free gas and I add in a stabilizer. E-Free gas is not easy to find in Houston, and it's a 16 mile trek one way to get it at Bucees.

 

I only use ethanol free in my bikes because sometimes they can sit for a week or so before I used them. All my power equipment gets ethanol free also. On boats its a must have as they sit for long periods. My car and truck use gas with ethanol but they use it up before it can begin to degrade and cause issues. I believe it takes 3 months before gas with ethanol starts to degrade. I base that upon a memo from work where we have a lot of vessels to maintain and keep running.

 

No Ethanol free fuel available in my area except for avgas at the local airport. I use E10.

 

HATE ethanol.....worst idea EVER!!!

 

I put in whatever gas is available at the pump and I ride the bike and never have problems. Store in an unheated garage for three months plus over the winter without stabilizer, in the spring it starts right up and I ride away. I have also had bikes stored for around a year with the same fuel in the tank, just start right up and ride away. That was pushing it, I don't think storing for more than six months without stabilizer is a very good idea. I have never had fuel related problems in any bike or car from ethanol or other additives, including vehicles and motorcycles ranging from 10 to 50 years old. Based on my personal experience, it's fine.

 

+1.

Degraded fuel can be an issue, but it is not always the boogey-man many make it out to be.

Years ago I bought a BMW K1100LT that had sat for a year. I knew the PO and up until he parked it he had taken good care of it.

So we made the deal, and I bought a new battery to take with me for taking delivery. I installed the battery and the bike fired up after a couple of turns of the engine. It did sputter and miss a bit as I rode off, cobwebs trailing in the wind.

I rode it to the nearest gas station, dumped in half a can of Seafoam, and topped off the tank with premium. Then I went on a 100 mile ride. By the time I got back home the engine was as smooth as a sewing machine.

I was more worried about rust in the tank than about corrupt fuel, so as soon as I got a chance I changed the fuel filter and just rode the sucker like I had stolen it.

 

Many carb owned motorcycle folks aren't fans of ethanol, in particular those of us with first gen Honda Valkyries........"6 carbs".

 

Thank you very much

 

Well, I'll throw my .02 in here.
Here is my take, If I'm riding I always use 10% eth, with no issues but when I store for the winter I run a couple tanks of NO eth and store with NO eth.
And as far as mower atv chain saw etc, No eth.

Eff nailed it

 

I've never had an issue, like vanislejay above I buy whatever is at the station that I happen to be stopping at and give it 0 thought. Half the time I don't even put premium in my V2. If gas prices are not to high then I treat it with premium haha. I never use any additives, engine treatments, etc Over winter I do put seafoam in to stabilize the fuel.

DRZ, lawnmower, snowblower, weed eater, etc all have carbs and all get ethanol and all have 0 issues.

The big thing though is not to let gas sit.. when I cut the grass I buy a few bucks worth of gas in a jerry can, fill up the lawn mower and dump the rest in the car. A tank of gas in the lawnmower lasts me about 2 cuts of the lawn so 2-4 weeks depending on the time of the year. Snowblower, I can clear the driveway 3-4 times with a tank of gas so I fill it up, dump the rest in the car. Having Jerry cans of gas sitting around for who knows how long, ethanol or not is a bad idea.

 

DRZ, lawnmower, snowblower, weed eater, etc all have carbs and all get ethanol and all have 0 issues.

I have had significant issues with ethanol and my carburetors. YZ's, snowblower, lawmowers, scooters, rototillers, sand rails, etc.

It definitely helps to keep the gas cycled and fresh (or drained). And I suspect it also has a lot to do with the age of the equipment and the amount of brass (or perhaps the specific brass alloy) in the carb. The bulk of my issues has nothing to do with gunk or varnish, but the literal corrosion of the brass itself. The ethanol/water/acid cocktail attacks the brass and turns it a fuzzy green and white (almost looks like mold). This reduces or completely seals off all the mixture jet orifices, starting with the tiny idle circuit ones. This corrosion doesn't typically just rinse off with a good carb cleaner either. It is a mess. This level of corrosion forms in less than the time between the riding seasons (i.e. it doesn't take forever). Furthermore, I don't live in a wet climate, rather dry on average actually...

It is best to drain the system after use, but that doesn't always get done. Therefore anything that doesn't get used frequently (i.e. the entire list mentioned above) gets E0 only just in case. Although, I'll admit that E0 is pretty easy for me to get around town. I can even get 91 octane E0 without working too hard.

 

Agreed, I run ethanol in my vehicles and have zero issues. But the biggest thing is to not let it sit. Ethanol is a-okay if its used in a vehicle that goes through a tank within a couple weeks. When my bike is stored, it gets E0, just to avoid issues.

 

Check this out.

 

"HATE ethanol.....worst idea EVER!!!"

You people have no respect for the Corn Conglomerates. What with the current deregulations and the need to keep the rich happy we should have E25 shoved down our throats.
They don't care that it will kill your vehicle. Only little people worry about that sort of thing, thank you Leona Helmsley for that thought.

 

My rule, based on all my years dealing with it, is that fuel injected engines are for the most part just fine on Ethanol mix. Most fuel injection systems are not open to atmosphere like a carburetor. ANYTHING with a carburetor is not so much. While fuel tanks in boats caused incredible problems when Ethanol fuel was/is used, for the most part carbureted engines in other stuff had fuel tanks that could handle the E10. Fuel LINES were not so able to deal with the alcohol. If your engine says "E10" on it, probably good to go. Even on newer carbureted stuff. But I hesitate to store these long term with E10.

I run regular E10 pump gas in my riding lawn mower. ALL other yard/utility engines run on non ethanol, and usually 110+ octane racing fuel. It just doesn't seem to ever go bad!

I put whatever I can buy in the bikes. I don't think getting water in the fuel and all the horror stories about buying a bad tank of fuel are all realistic. Or I would have found out by now! Very hard to find non-ethanol around here, I wouldn't pay extra for it anyway.

 

Ecologically unsound

I refuse to buy ethanol gas because it is ecologically unsound. Net, it produces more pollution (air, water, soil) due to the amount of oil burned in producing it, along with all the ag-chemicals added to the environment, not to mention the water consumed. If you keep your vehicles only a few years, I doubt you'll have time to see the problems caused by ethanol. I keep mine 15-20, and I'm not interested in finding that out.

I have seen first-hand evidence of damage to small engines from ethanol. Was given a lawn mower that ethanol killed. Rebuilt the carb, changed the fuel lines and filters, flushed out the gunk in the bottom of the (fortunately) plastic gas tank. Been using it for a couple of years now. Chainsaws, same story. There is no good reason to add ethanol to gas, except to keep the farmers happy. It does not replace oil, it just converts oil into ethanol.

Yes, if you are diligent about keeping it fresh, you may get by with it in modern engines. Operative word being 'may'. I see no reason to take the chance.

I'd be less concerned if consumers were given a choice to buy ethanol. But that choice is getting harder and harder to find. Many local stations have nothing but ethanol gas. And now the farmers, in a slump, want us to use more ethanol. I don't think so.

Good news is, with modern cars using closed-loop fuel injection, the oxygen sensor controls the fuel mixture, so a 'lean-burn' condition is unlikely to occur. Besides, in airplanes, where running 'lean of peak' was avoided for decades, they've actually found that there are benefits to operating an engine lean of peak exhaust temp, so long as the engine is still running smoothly. And that is predominantly in air-cooled engines, where valve temps can be a problem.

 

I refuse to buy ethanol gas because it is ecologically unsound. Net, it produces more pollution (air, water, soil) due to the amount of oil burned in producing it, along with all the ag-chemicals added to the environment, not to mention the water consumed. If you keep your vehicles only a few years, I doubt you'll have time to see the problems caused by ethanol. I keep mine 15-20, and I'm not interested in finding that out.

I have seen first-hand evidence of damage to small engines from ethanol. Was given a lawn mower that ethanol killed. Rebuilt the carb, changed the fuel lines and filters, flushed out the gunk in the bottom of the (fortunately) plastic gas tank. Been using it for a couple of years now. Chainsaws, same story. There is no good reason to add ethanol to gas, except to keep the farmers happy. It does not replace oil, it just converts oil into ethanol.

Yes, if you are diligent about keeping it fresh, you may get by with it in modern engines. Operative word being 'may'. I see no reason to take the chance.

I'd be less concerned if consumers were given a choice to buy ethanol. But that choice is getting harder and harder to find. Many local stations have nothing but ethanol gas. And now the farmers, in a slump, want us to use more ethanol. I don't think so.

Good news is, with modern cars using closed-loop fuel injection, the oxygen sensor controls the fuel mixture, so a 'lean-burn' condition is unlikely to occur. Besides, in airplanes, where running 'lean of peak' was avoided for decades, they've actually found that there are benefits to operating an engine lean of peak exhaust temp, so long as the engine is still running smoothly. And that is predominantly in air-cooled engines, where valve temps can be a problem.

So what happens when you are out riding and/or driving and nearing empty and the only fuel around is E10.

Here in the North East and Mid Atlantic region ethanol free fuel is as rare as rocking horse shit. Its also some of the best riding areas you'd ever desire. So if E10 fuel keeps you away its less road I need to share.

 

Better gas mileage, better performance, longer lasting engine are all good reasons to steer clear of E10 if you have a choice.

 

How much decrease in engine life span should we expect running E10? How much less performance verses running straight gasoline?



I really enjoy the folks who state they only use ethanol free gasoline. I guess that's great if you live and only travel where its available. Personally I'd run E100 if that all that's available. It sure beats pushing.

 

196000kms worth of E10 in my Vee and all is well.

The bike has never been stored or had stabiliser in it.

 

Oh, fudgesnacks, this tired old topic again?

V-Stroms, like every modern vehicle, are designed for E10 and as long as you ride the damn thing once in a while, it'll be fine and you'll never notice any difference. Period. Seeking out gas without ethanol is a waste of time (and futile in much of the US).

If you only ride to the tavern twice a year, dump in some fuel stabilizer, whether or not you have E10 in your tank.

No, of course ethanol in gasoline is not ideal, especially if you prefer to neglect your machinery, but it is our current reality.


Of course, it's beyond stupid in several ways to make ethanol for fuel out of food crops, or to force gasoline makers to add ethanol to gas, but these are separate issues. The reality is that the stuff is in almost all gas (and it's not always labeled or required to be labeled), and with very few exceptions vehicles in the US have been designed for it for decades.

 

Due to the corrosive nature of Ethanol, it can't be blended into the fuel going through the pipelines. It's added to the gas at the distributor level. Also serves as an octane booster, as unleaded gas comes through pipelines at 84 or 90/91 pump octane. Zero Ethanol gas stations typically use blender pumps, mixing in the 90 or 91 with the 84 to provide the 87 or 89 pump octanes. When government subsidies, per gallon, were given to distributors to add Ethanol, there were numerous abuses. Fla. was often in the news where people tested stations selling 30 and 40% ethanol. Fla since rescinded their alcohol fuel mandate. The Ethanol lobby is strong and ready to jump on fires of resistance.

All EPA emissions testing and fuel economy ratings are done using zero Ethanol fuel.

There are 9 different zero Ethanol stations within 9 to 35 miles of my home in Eastern PA. I'm usually passing near one of them in local rides. I'm also glad for them for small engine equipment at home, for with I store fuel for some time ( with stabilizer). The cost is usually about $.30 to $.50 more than the same octane E10. That's mostly made up with increased fuel mileage. I agree with those that think the E10 isn't a big problem with frequently used newer vehicles. On a older car or truck, on E10, you will wind up with water in the bottom of your tank from the hygroscopic effect and garbage from the phase separation.

The Eastern half of Pa. isn't hard to find E0 gas in and New York state is awash with E0 stations ( mostly 91 octane only). There's user listings and a national map of E0 stations at Pure-gas.org.

 

Around me there is 1 station w/ 89 octane E0gasoline. Its about $0.90 more per gallon and when I tried it in my BMW it pinged and the fuel mileage was no better.


I'm not sure why new vehicles aren't susceptible but older vehicles are susceptible the ills of ethanol. Or why only in older vehicles would water collect in the fuel tank (you said it not me). Can ethanol tell the age of a tank?

I've had 1972, 75, 76, 77, 78, 80 & 81 carb'ed some with points (can't get any more old school) and some with electronic ignition and they all ran fine on E10 fuel. I also had up to 9 bikes at one with most of the bikes seeing under 200 miles per year. On the old Guzzi's 6.6 gallon tank and 50 MPG are not uncommon so one r two fill up per year wasn't uncommon. All the while no issue with E10 fuel. I have a $50 2 cycle weed eater I bought at Walmart, I'm still using the same gallon of E10 and sample of $0.50 2 stroke oil that came with the trimmer that this year will be 4 years old. Prime the bulb 5 time a couple pulls and she fires right up.

My snow blower has fuel setting it in year round and only get used on average once or twice a year sometime no times per year. Plug in the starter hit the button and after a few spins it starts.

I'm not saying the some folks aren't experiencing issues related to ethanol in fuel I saying its not the monumental pandemic every make it out to believe. I mean read through here guys are to the point if they don't ride their bike for 20 minutes the E10 will render the bike inoperable.

Some of the worst carbs I've seen were old Dellorotos that sat with E0 gasoline in them for decades. The varnish was so thick they needed soaked for days just to get them apart. That wasn't so much the function of E0 gasoline but rather the sands of time.

I'd also caution you on pure-gas.org. It isn't updated very frequently so if you are planning a trip and are relying on pure-gas.org for fuel stops you'd better call in advance to verify the station still does or does not carry E0 fuel and in what grade.

 

A friend of mine rebuilt the carburettors on his TRX, 2 weeks later he was still having trouble this time when he dismantled the carburettors he found all the rubber gaskets had swollen and were much larger than they should be, he rang a TRX expert he knows looking for answers, the expert knew straightaway he had used E10 in his bike, he fitted new gaskets and never used ethanol again.

I have never used ethanol in any of my motors but having 23 bikes many sit for long periods of time without being started, I have found my high performance high compression motors suffer badly when the fuel get old but my low performance low stress farm bikes don't care about old fuel.

I have a couple of DT175 two strokes that still have the oil injection pumps working and they can sit for over a year but will still start after a couple of kicks providing the fuel still smells like fuel.

By that I mean I have found as fuel gets older the smell changes and when starts to smell like turpentine even my low stress motors will struggle to run on it.

 

Possibly

Possibly fuel formulations are different in different areas of the country. Or perhaps there are weather considerations (warmer, more humid, etc.). Talked to a number of small-engine repair places locally, and they say that ethanol gas keeps them in business. The neighbor's weed whip refused to start after sitting over the winter with ethanol gas. Dumped it, put in fresh gas, started right up. Clearly it degraded in a short period of time. The mower I was given had a layer of gunk in the bottom of the gas tank, the fuel lines were sloughing off into the filter, and the float needle seat had swelled shut. Cleaned the tank, changed the fuel line and filter, rebuilt the carb. Been running fine ever since.

Not sure what octane the gasoline is that they blend with ethanol to get 87 octane. Obviously a lower grade. It'd be interesting to test six-month-old samples of ethanol gas to what degradation takes place, if any. Ethanol is also somewhat corrosive, according to some reports, and may affect metal parts.

Evidently some people don't have problems with ethanol gas. Many people do. The hygroscopic nature of ethanol may help, or may hurt. If you live in a humid area (as I do), the ethanol will continuously bind with water in the air in the tank. Gasoline will not. If that air circulates (heating and cooling) it will keep drawing in more and more water, where gasoline will not.

I see no reason to support a bad system by buying ethanol gas. If the choice is buy it or run out, then yeah, I'd buy it.

Mostly, I want to have the choice. I prefer to apply my ethanol internally (scotch or gin) than run it in my various engines. If they figure out a way to generate it from plant waste, and it runs fuel-cell cars, then I'd have a different outlook. Although an alcohol with more hydrogen content (methanol, etc.) would make more sense.

 

I carry Star Tron if I am forced (i.e. no non ethanol gas available) to use ethanol gas, otherwise I only use non-ethanol in all my engines.

 

Here's where to find non-ethanol gas. Pick your state at the bottom. https://www.pure-gas.org

 

nothing near bishop, CA.