[Maco]

This is what worked for me:
2010 DL1000 12,000KM

TPS checked(no adjustment needed)
Cleaned TB boots and made sure they are properly installed.
TBS adjusted (love my Morgan Carb tune for this)
Iridium Plugs (Maintenance item as I was working on the bike)
Secondaries removed(I like them gone)
ATRE(improved the low end by 70%)
Yosh Box 5% idle 5% low (improved the remaining 30%)

I love the low end on my Vstrom now and it is a joy to pull from the low end all the way to redline. There is useable power from about 2000 RPM up so getting stuck in traffic is no longer so annoying. There has also been an improvement in the mid range power where the motor feels a lot more responsive.

 

[bsevans5]

Thread resurrection...

I've got a 2007 vstrom 1000. its got about 32k miles. Earlier this year I did a TPS replacement, TBS, and synced the secondary plates. Mostly ran find after that with some inconsistent momentary stumbling. It would go away when I accelerated through it. I had a 3k mile trip that was canceled at the last minute, but decided to ride the bike to northern Utah (300 miles away) where my family was going to hang out while I was on my ride. I've now experienced a pretty consistent stumbling at around 3800 rpm. I've searched the forum and other resources online and am not quite sure what to do. Some say a yosh box thingy. Some say power commander. I don't know where I'd find a yosh box. I don't really have the money for a power commander. I tried to get a new ECU from suzuki through the local dealer. They weren't any help and suggested I write to suzuki myself. I did and after many weeks I got a letter back saying that the problem was on bikes older than mine and mine had the non-problematic ecu.

I know the smart alec comments will be to stay out of that range, but I've done more than one ride where 3500-3800 rpms is where the bike was wanting to cruise at based on the speed limit. gearing down to be over 4k rpms seemed too high for the speed I was traveling.

Would I need to do another TBS already? Any affordable suggestions? I thought I finally had all the kinks worked out after that maintenance mentioned above, so I put money into OEM seals (one was leaking) and upgraded springs along with some other farkles. I'm not in the position to keep dumping money into this thing. I've gone far out of my expertise and learned to fix a lot of things I've never tried on any other bike before, but it is quite frustrating to invest all that time researching the fixes, doing the fixes (very slowly to ensure they are done correctly) and then to have more problems. If I had the money for another bike, I'd go get one...but I don't. So--anyone out there have any ideas?

Thanks.

 

[realshelby]

Is the hesitation felt when you have some throttle on, like when accelerating, or just cruising at light throttle?

One thing you didn't mention is checking the throttle body rubber boots. A known problem, they are very prone to coming loose after a backfire. This allows unmetered air into the engine and causes all kinds of fueling issues. You might have to pull the tank to inspect them properly. You can get by with reseating them and tightening the clamps better, some go further with the fix for it. Checking them is good for now. If your throttle bodies are properly synched, tps bar is raising around 1700-1800 rpm, and the secondary throttle plates are not too far off you might still get an occasional hiccup but nothing like you are describing.

If you are feeling this as you accelerate it could be the clutch basket. While the engine isn't misfiring, I have had many owners say that is what it feels like. While riding through the 2500-4000 rpm range gently feather the clutch lever. Not so much the clutch slips, just enough to load the pressure plate a bit. If this smooths out the engine significantly, you can bet the clutch basket is worn.

While I am not usually a believer in engine treatments, I do have some faith in Sea Foam fuel system cleaner. On the off chance you have an injector not firing well, there is a chance the Sea Foam will clean it up a bit. It won't hurt anything at any rate.

 

[OydnaR]

I have always had a stumble, since day one, until my first ride after my 2 into 1 exhaust conversion

 

[bsevans5]

Is the hesitation felt when you have some throttle on, like when accelerating, or just cruising at light throttle?

One thing you didn't mention is checking the throttle body rubber boots. A known problem, they are very prone to coming loose after a backfire. This allows unmetered air into the engine and causes all kinds of fueling issues. You might have to pull the tank to inspect them properly. You can get by with reseating them and tightening the clamps better, some go further with the fix for it. Checking them is good for now. If your throttle bodies are properly synched, tps bar is raising around 1700-1800 rpm, and the secondary throttle plates are not too far off you might still get an occasional hiccup but nothing like you are describing.

If you are feeling this as you accelerate it could be the clutch basket. While the engine isn't misfiring, I have had many owners say that is what it feels like. While riding through the 2500-4000 rpm range gently feather the clutch lever. Not so much the clutch slips, just enough to load the pressure plate a bit. If this smooths out the engine significantly, you can bet the clutch basket is worn.

While I am not usually a believer in engine treatments, I do have some faith in Sea Foam fuel system cleaner. On the off chance you have an injector not firing well, there is a chance the Sea Foam will clean it up a bit. It won't hurt anything at any rate.

The hesitation is felt when accelerating. Haven't had a backfire, but I can check the boots. Didn't think it was the boots as it only happens in this one rpm spot in several gears. When I did all that work I mentioned in my previous post I cleaned them real well and made sure they were well seated and tightened them real good to avoid having that problem, but would be worth checking I guess. I haven't used seafoam, but I have put in suzuki brand fuel injection cleaner.

If I do a quick acceleration through the gears (like getting on the freeway) it doesn't happen. If it is a gradual acceleration or if I am in a gear cruising along and have to let off the throttle to slow and the RPMs drop below 3500 and then slowly accelerate back up it happens. If the throttle is twisted quickly and I go through that rpm spot quickly it isn't experienced. I can try feathering the clutch. Don't have any other clutch issues that I am aware of in any gear or any other range. This seems to be the "lean" issue people have discussed, but there seem to be a whole bunch of fixes and I'm not in the position to just start trying a bunch of expensive things like aftermarket exhaust and power commanders and such. Seems like there should be a better option, especially when it didn't used to happen as frequently.

Thanks.

 

[realshelby]

Typically fueling issues on these bikes happens at light throttle. Your latest description doesn't sound much like a clutch. Under light to moderate acceleration about the only way it is going to act up is if there is a very lean or very rich condition. Vee's are typically rather lean in the lower rpms ( actually quite rich under full throttle at mid to higher rpms). Lean conditions typically give more of a stumble, as it is a misfire condition.

Which points back to too much air getting to the cylinder for the amount of fuel metered. Look carefully for any vacuum lines out of place, rubber plugs missing ( off throttle bodies for instance ) and of course the throttle body boots. I would also do a careful setting of the secondary throttles, then the Throttle body synch again. You can check the tps, but being new I doubt it is a likely problem.

 

[bsevans5]

Typically fueling issues on these bikes happens at light throttle. Your latest description doesn't sound much like a clutch. Under light to moderate acceleration about the only way it is going to act up is if there is a very lean or very rich condition. Vee's are typically rather lean in the lower rpms ( actually quite rich under full throttle at mid to higher rpms). Lean conditions typically give more of a stumble, as it is a misfire condition.

Which points back to too much air getting to the cylinder for the amount of fuel metered. Look carefully for any vacuum lines out of place, rubber plugs missing ( off throttle bodies for instance ) and of course the throttle body boots. I would also do a careful setting of the secondary throttles, then the Throttle body synch again. You can check the tps, but being new I doubt it is a likely problem.

I'll go in and check for missing plugs and loose boots as suggested. Would the secondary plates and throttle body be out of sync after only a number of months (5-ish)? I did those when I replaced the TPS. I guess I'll have to sync them again just to rule it out. wonder where to go from there if that doesn't solve it...and if it does...what do I do to keep them in sync longer than a few months?

 

[realshelby]

Unless something changes, they should stay in synch for quite a while.

But you are chasing an unknown condition, so figure on going through the basic stuff again to eliminate any easy fix. For instance, you could have had a very small vacuum leak when you done the TBS. Now it is bigger, like a hose falling off. For sure if you find a vacuum leak you should do a TBS at least.

I would be tempted to install the proper Iridium spark plugs if I had the fuel tank off again. These plugs will ignite the fuel/air charge more consistently in a lean condition.

 

[bsevans5]

Unless something changes, they should stay in synch for quite a while.

But you are chasing an unknown condition, so figure on going through the basic stuff again to eliminate any easy fix. For instance, you could have had a very small vacuum leak when you done the TBS. Now it is bigger, like a hose falling off. For sure if you find a vacuum leak you should do a TBS at least.

I would be tempted to install the proper Iridium spark plugs if I had the fuel tank off again. These plugs will ignite the fuel/air charge more consistently in a lean condition.

Did the plugs when i do that other stuff. Also did valve clearance check and some other stuff. I'll have to go back in and recheck everything i guess.

 

[bsevans5]

Havent returned from my trip yet, so i havent been able to do a TBS, but i did get in and check for any possible vacuum leak and everything looked good.

 

[bobbyvstrom]

OK. This is not difficult. The non-current Vees run lean at low rpm and throttle settings to meet emission requirements. You need to add fuel for the low rpm running to be smooth. You can have a shop do this with a Yosh or Teka box or get a PCFC. Do not waste your money on a PC III or V or any of that. The PCFCs are pretty cheap. the others cost more because they have functions that only race bikes might use. Also, just remove the secondaries. Their primary function is to slow the bike down in 5th and 6th. They may make it run smoother at low rpms but once you fix the mixture problem, you don't need them and you pick up several horsepower in 5th and 6th for passing, etc. Nobody is going to whack the throttle at 2,000 rpm anyhow. This is all assuming that your bike is not running badly because of not having the normal stuff in adjustment. That is all there is to it.

 

[bsevans5]

OK. This is not difficult. The non-current Vees run lean at low rpm and throttle settings to meet emission requirements. You need to add fuel for the low rpm running to be smooth. You can have a shop do this with a Yosh or Teka box or get a PCFC. Do not waste your money on a PC III or V or any of that. The PCFCs are pretty cheap. the others cost more because they have functions that only race bikes might use. Also, just remove the secondaries. Their primary function is to slow the bike down in 5th and 6th. They may make it run smoother at low rpms but once you fix the mixture problem, you don't need them and you pick up several horsepower in 5th and 6th for passing, etc. Nobody is going to whack the throttle at 2,000 rpm anyhow. This is all assuming that your bike is not running badly because of not having the normal stuff in adjustment. That is all there is to it.

The problem didn't really present itself until recently. I wonder if after replacing the TPS and doing the TBS I finally got the bike tuned like its supposed to be...which resulted in this common problem. I'll have to call around the few places there are in town and see if anyone has a Yosh box or Teka box. That sounds like the least expensive attempt to fix the problem. I ran out of funds a few fixes and farkles ago trying to get the bike ready for my first road trip. It was cancelled, but I need to get this problem fixed anyway. I've read mixed reviews about removing the secondary plates. I'll start with trying to get the bike reprogrammed. If not, maybe I can find a used pcfc or something. I appreciate the input! Love the forum.

 

[Jim L]

Hey bsevans, If you can't find a Yosh box up there, I know Tom at Nevada Suzuki here in Vegas has one.

 

[bsevans5]

Hey bsevans, If you can't find a Yosh box up there, I know Tom at Nevada Suzuki here in Vegas has one.

Jim L...thanks for the heads up. I called the three main dealers today (motozoo, honda/polaris, and rocky mountain atv) and no one has one. Honda was at least nice enough to tell me of a repair shop they think might have a dyno, but I'm not sure if that would help or not. Biggest challenge will be finding the time to ride down and back and however long it will take to have it worked on (2 hours each way) and that is hoping it works without having to play around with it at all.

This is a pretty area...but a sorry place to live for bike help. One service department (the suzuki dealership) said that it isn't likely the mapping from the factory. Said that wouldn't change over time. I do think its strange I've had the bike for over 2 years and it didn't do this before, but I'm wondering if it was so far out of sync that after I changed the tps and then did a throttle body sync, the bike is finally back to the way it was supposed to be, which is causing the factory settings of lean mixture to finally show itself. I don't know, but whatever it is, it is really annoying and not something I feel I should have to live with. After all the work I've put into the bike I can't be satisfied to have it running so poorly in that 3500-4000 rpm range. I've gotta come up with something. Maybe it will require a ride to vegas?

 

[Jim L]

The Vee I bought a few months ago was running like crap when I test drove it, (bad for the seller, but good for me) but I already knew about the lean problem, so the first thing I did was order the PCFC installed it and everything has been fine since.

 

[pknankivell]

The hesitation is felt when accelerating. Haven't had a backfire, but I can check the boots. Didn't think it was the boots as it only happens in this one rpm spot in several gears. When I did all that work I mentioned in my previous post I cleaned them real well and made sure they were well seated and tightened them real good to avoid having that problem, but would be worth checking I guess. I haven't used seafoam, but I have put in suzuki brand fuel injection cleaner.

If I do a quick acceleration through the gears (like getting on the freeway) it doesn't happen. If it is a gradual acceleration or if I am in a gear cruising along and have to let off the throttle to slow and the RPMs drop below 3500 and then slowly accelerate back up it happens. If the throttle is twisted quickly and I go through that rpm spot quickly it isn't experienced. I can try feathering the clutch. Don't have any other clutch issues that I am aware of in any gear or any other range. This seems to be the "lean" issue people have discussed, but there seem to be a whole bunch of fixes and I'm not in the position to just start trying a bunch of expensive things like aftermarket exhaust and power commanders and such. Seems like there should be a better option, especially when it didn't used to happen as frequently.

Thanks.

This is my first post. Is it too late to help? BSevans5 describes similar symptoms I had with my DL1000 2010. My problem was an ignition breakdown on the front cylinder caused by the high tension lead or cord being routed BELOW the PAIR valve hose. See workshop manual page 8-18 for correct routing. When I attempted to accelerate heavily in a high gear from low revs the bike would become a "one lunger". The HT lead shorted out as it was pressed hard against the rocker cover by the heavy hose. I believe this defect was caused by my mechanic when he checked valve clearances at 24,000km. I found the problem a few months later. Hope this helps.

 

[Andy h]

Hi, I'm new to this group and have a kawasaki klv1000 which is a suzuki v-strom dl100. I have the same rough spot on mine but only in 5th gear at 3500rpm. I see from the messages there is a chat about tbs, what is it please.

 

[realshelby]

If only in one gear at a certain load or rpm.....that might not be a fueling issue.
Have you closely inspected your front sprocket for wear? Checked the chain for any red dust around any links or kinking? You might be surprised at how often these things cause what is interpreted as a miss/flat spot in throttle or a vibration.

 

[BackPacker]

I see from the messages there is a chat about tbs, what is it please.

TBS is shorthand for Throttle Body Sync. It ensures the vacuum pressure in both throttle bodies is the same across the RPM range. This is important: The ECU only has pressure sensors on the front cylinder. So it injects a quantity of fuel into both throttle bodies based on the pressure sensed in the front throttle body. If the pressure in the rear is substantially off, then the mixture in the rear is either too lean or too rich, leading to erratic running.

A TBS should be done at every 12.000km or 7500 miles. It's a standard procedure that's written up in the service manual. My '02 service manual calls it the Throttle Valve Synchronisation.

To perform a TBS you need a vacuum gauge with multiple heads, so you can read vacuum in both bodies at the same time. Or you can make your own out of a long piece of clear plastic tubing and some water (with a bit of dye in it for better visibility).

 

[Jonstorp]

. Or you can make your own out of a long piece of clear plastic tubing and some water (with a bit of dye in it for better visibility).

This works great! I used this method in the past, but with Castrol engine oil. It is red, so it was easy to see. I wouldn't use water.. if something fails, like if one end of the hose detaches, then the water would get sucked in the cylinder.. Also, oil doesn't fluctuate as much as water.