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My buddy's new KTM 790R sure is pretty and has top notch components, but time will tell if it will even be in the same league in terms of reliability, as his previous 12 650 he sold it for. :) It's fast/powerful and extremely off pavement capable, but he's given up touring manners and comfort for all that.....always a trade off.
 

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My buddy's new KTM 790R sure is pretty and has top notch components, but time will tell if it will even be in the same league in terms of reliability, as his previous 12 650 he sold it for. :) It's fast/powerful and extremely off pavement capable, but he's given up touring manners and comfort for all that.....always a trade off.
There is so much more to this story. How long did he have his DL? How many miles did he put on it? Did he like it? Did it suite his riding needs/style? Did he do big long trips spending hours daily grinding pavement? Does he enjoy off road Adventure like the TAT and being off pavement more? Its quite possible that maybe the tradeoffs given up are what you hold near and dear to your heart but not his.
 

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There is so much more to this story. How long did he have his DL? How many miles did he put on it? Did he like it? Did it suite his riding needs/style? Did he do big long trips spending hours daily grinding pavement? Does he enjoy off road Adventure like the TAT and being off pavement more? Its quite possible that maybe the tradeoffs given up are what you hold near and dear to your heart but not his.
Well......his 12 650 was used as a touring machine and a light off pavement machine "had less than 20K miles I believe", his 790 is being used as the same with perhaps more off pavement aspirations. He also has a Beta 350 and a Gas Gas trials bike, so he is very familiar with trade offs and bikes which are designed/intended for certain riding. The KTM in all likelihood won't be as reliable as a V-Strom, but makes no difference likely in his mind as the KTM is quite the performance machine compared to a V-Strom.

You LOVE your Euro bikes and defend them to the teeth, but some of us are not willing to go down the Euro bike road or perhaps they've been on that road and will NEVER go down it again. Ride what you like and like what you ride.......you've made your choice and have your obvious preference.
 

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Well......his 12 650 was used as a touring machine and a light off pavement machine "had less than 20K miles I believe", his 790 is being used as the same with perhaps more off pavement aspirations. He also has a Beta 350 and a Gas Gas trials bike, so he is very familiar with trade offs and bikes which are designed/intended for certain riding. The KTM in all likelihood won't be as reliable as a V-Strom, but makes no difference likely in his mind as the KTM is quite the performance machine compared to a V-Strom.

You LOVE your Euro bikes and defend them to the teeth, but some of us are not willing to go down the Euro bike road or perhaps they've been on that road and will NEVER go down it again. Ride what you like and like what you ride.......you've made your choice and have your obvious preference.
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Yep you win. He's a fool for giving up the DL for a KTM. He should buy what you think best suites is needs.

Yes I prefer Euro bikes but I also have and had Asian big 4 bikes. Expierence not internet lore tell me Euro trash isn't as bad as many would have you believe.
 

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Ah yes the current forum curmudgeon.......where did I EVER say he made a mistake for buying the bike he wanted? It's quite the performance machine, but yes he was hesitant to buy it due to obvious KTM internet lore, and it also being a first year new model. So far its been a great machine and he loves it, and so far he's been totally honest about where it excels or falls short of his previous Strom. You have quite the strong opinions and mindset yourself bud, in particular when you believe that so many here only worship the Stroms and don't recommend or like any other bikes out there "or don't do things the way you think they should". The WINNER is the owner of the bike they love and connect with, otherwise sell the damn thing and go buy another. Doubt I'll ever own a Euro bike personally, but yeah I sure think they are purty and run like a scalded dog when they run as designed/intended, but I just feel more comfortable with the Japanese or American options.
 

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Ah yes the current forum curmudgeon.......where did I EVER say he made a mistake for buying the bike he wanted? It's quite the performance machine, but yes he was hesitant to buy it due to obvious KTM internet lore, and it also being a first year new model. So far its been a great machine and he loves it, and so far he's been totally honest about where it excels or falls short of his previous Strom. You have quite the strong opinions and mindset yourself bud, in particular when you believe that so many here only worship the Stroms and don't recommend or like any other bikes out there "or don't do things the way you think they should". The WINNER is the owner of the bike they love and connect with, otherwise sell the damn thing and go buy another. Doubt I'll ever own a Euro bike personally, but yeah I sure think they are purty and run like a scalded dog when they run as designed/intended, but I just feel more comfortable with the Japanese or American options.

There are many here that are DL-centric and I get it, its a DL site. What else would one expect, bud? Its like the Ford and Chevy guys protecting their brand. I had a DL and it was a good bike. It wasn't great and it wasn't horrible. It was a UJM. I don't regret buying it or selling it. Same way with all the other Asian big 4 or European stuff I've had. Don't regret buying it or selling any of them. Honestly I'm glad for all the bikes over the years I've bought. Each and every one has helped me figure out what I want in motorcycles. If I never tried anything different I'd never no any different.
 

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I think it's a good idea not to care too much about what others ride or why. It's up to the individual.

I had a Triumph and really liked it. Mine was reliable for the time I owned it. It could be said it had some character that many Japanese bikes don't quite have. But lots of people wouldn't touch a Triumph for their own reasons. I don't feel compelled to say my Sprint was a better bike than my Wee Strom, though some aspects were better. Who cares what I think ?

Either way, all opinions, likes, preferences are reflected in the act of the person laying down the cash. Can people make bad choices? Sure but generally, people buy what they want and it's no one else's business what someone likes or doesn't. There are many factors in a person's decision on what is the best bike at the moment. The best bike to them, is the one they buy.
 

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There are many here that are DL-centric and I get it, its a DL site. What else would one expect, bud? Its like the Ford and Chevy guys protecting their brand. I had a DL and it was a good bike. It wasn't great and it wasn't horrible. It was a UJM. I don't regret buying it or selling it. Same way with all the other Asian big 4 or European stuff I've had. Don't regret buying it or selling any of them. Honestly I'm glad for all the bikes over the years I've bought. Each and every one has helped me figure out what I want in motorcycles. If I never tried anything different I'd never no any different.
Yes of course bias is expected from many here, but many also have owned lots of different motorcycles over the years and are even current owners of more than one bike. You defend BMW's to the hilt, where some former owners here would never buy another one due to "their" personal ownership experience, but that most certainly doesn't make them overall unreliable bikes. The Stroms have had and perhaps still have their fly in the ointment problems, not many motorcycles are hammer reliable out there nor have they ever been. My buds with GS machines love them, have also had great ownership experiences thus far, same goes for my bud who owns the new 790R. Yup every one of them have owned a V-Strom, they all loved their Stroms as well, but yes the BMW's and the KTM are a step above in many categories, however the latest 1000 is for sure starting to make some headway.
 

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Discussion Starter #170
Yes of course bias is expected from many here, but many also have owned lots of different motorcycles over the years and are even current owners of more than one bike. You defend BMW's to the hilt, where some former owners here would never buy another one due to "their" personal ownership experience, but that most certainly doesn't make them overall unreliable bikes. The Stroms have had and perhaps still have their fly in the ointment problems, not many motorcycles are hammer reliable out there nor have they ever been. My buds with GS machines love them, have also had great ownership experiences thus far, same goes for my bud who owns the new 790R. Yup every one of them have owned a V-Strom, they all loved their Stroms as well, but yes the BMW's and the KTM are a step above in many categories, however the latest 1000 is for sure starting to make some headway.
Big B, GOOD way to put the ideas into words.
I have only owned my 2018 DL1000 for 70 miles. Considering it is new at 9k where as a new GS would be a good bit more than double that, I do not see the value of a BMW. If I would need a dealer to fix the "ZOOK", i could almost push the bike there!!!! Should that unthinkable thing happen with the GS that will require 2 days out of my life & over 800 miles, should I have "drop it off".
As for looks, neither or both look good. As for speed, both can put you under the jail in less than 4 seconds. AS for off road, why do people want to go so fast in dirt anyway? As for repair, I have wasted enough money on the 15+ bikes I have owned. I want to ride more and spend less. It is nice to think that the Strom might be less of a target for thieves ! A more thorough review after break in etc.
 

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I've ridden a 790Duke, a new one. Bike arrived before the riders license upgrade so he asked me to play delivery rider. Nice bike, certainly my DL1000 wouldn't pop a wheelie at 90kph. Glad it's not my bike even so.

I will credit KTM with honesty though - the motto is "Ready to race" and that's pretty much exactly right but anyone who's actually owned a race bike/car/boat/bicycle will know the downsides.
 

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I've ridden a 790Duke, a new one. Bike arrived before the riders license upgrade so he asked me to play delivery rider. Nice bike, certainly my DL1000 wouldn't pop a wheelie at 90kph. Glad it's not my bike even so.

I will credit KTM with honesty though - the motto is "Ready to race" and that's pretty much exactly right but anyone who's actually owned a race bike/car/boat/bicycle will know the downsides.
That's how I felt on my buddy's new Ducati Multistrada, doing 155hp power wheelies at will and it makes some beautiful noises as well. :)
 

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I had a 1998 GS, and I loved it. I've had a 2014 DL for over 4 years, and I love it. I looked at the new GS before buying the DL, and I came away thinking it was just too much: too much electronics, too much automation, too much money. I still prefer shaft bikes, but chain maintenance is much easier than it was back in the 70s and 80s, and honestly I hardly ever think about it--just spray the thing every few hundred miles. In my view, the DL has it over the GS because it's
  • lighter
  • simpler
  • cheaper (much, much cheaper)
Right now, the bike represents a good compromise for me: it rides like a big bike (because it is a big bike) and it's plenty frisky, but it doesn't have a ginormous engine, it doesn't weigh a ton, it doesn't have electronic everything, and it doesn't cost a mint. I win.
 

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I had been looking at GS/AfricaTwin/Tigers/MultiStada for the last year. The Strom was not even on my list. However, I finally had some time to start doing some serious research. This one does this OK, but not that. That one does that OK, but not this. While researching these bikes,I kept coming across articles about the Strom. The Strom: Does nothing great, but ALL well. The more I read on it, there more I questioned how it slipped by me. I mostly tour with short jaunts offroad: perfect for the Strom! The Strom also looks to be the most reliable, with the most aftermarket support as well. Then I looked up a few for pricing and that's what made my final decision. $8000 for a New 2018 Strom 1000xt. I bought it sight unseen from halfway across the world. Even after ordering full touring gear (luggage,heated grips, throttle lock, dash cam - you name it). I still spent 65% of what I was going to spend for one of those other bikes with touring gear, and the Strom will most likely be more reliable. I went with the 1000 over the 650 because I will have a passenger 50% of the time (and I'm 6'3" 210 lbs)

Another great thing about the V-Strom is this website. Seeing how much support is available and how everyone loves their bikes, tells me I definitely made the right decision. Hopefully I will be back in the US and able to pick up my bike by this time next week. Can't wait to HIT THE ROAD!
 

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Discussion Starter #175
I had been looking at GS/AfricaTwin/Tigers/MultiStada for the last year. The Strom was not even on my list. However, I finally had some time to start doing some serious research. This one does this OK, but not that. That one does that OK, but not this. While researching these bikes,I kept coming across articles about the Strom. The Strom: Does nothing great, but ALL well. The more I read on it, there more I questioned how it slipped by me. I mostly tour with short jaunts offroad: perfect for the Strom! The Strom also looks to be the most reliable, with the most aftermarket support as well. Then I looked up a few for pricing and that's what made my final decision. $8000 for a New 2018 Strom 1000xt. I bought it sight unseen from halfway across the world. Even after ordering full touring gear (luggage,heated grips, throttle lock, dash cam - you name it). I still spent 65% of what I was going to spend for one of those other bikes with touring gear, and the Strom will most likely be more reliable. I went with the 1000 over the 650 because I will have a passenger 50% of the time (and I'm 6'3" 210 lbs)

Another great thing about the V-Strom is this website. Seeing how much support is available and how everyone loves their bikes, tells me I definitely made the right decision. Hopefully I will be back in the US and able to pick up my bike by this time next week. Can't wait to HIT THE ROAD!
Yes sir you are correct! I bought a nos 2018 Vstrom 1000, for all the same reasons. And Yes indeed, this website/ forum is a fantastic source.

It is amazing how things work out. When I started looking for a machine, there were no less than 25+ nos Vstrom's ( 1000) across the fruited plain. Now most are gone. OTOH, many if not most of the BMW's are still waiting for an owner!!!! THAT speaks volumes. I wonder if the "father-land" studies this or for that matter even cares?

I want to shout out a big thank you to all who responded here. Also a big thank you to the folks responsible for this site!
I am at peace and very satisfied. :) 🏍 👍
 

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Yes sir you are correct! I bought a nos 2018 Vstrom 1000, for all the same reasons. And Yes indeed, this website/ forum is a fantastic source.

It is amazing how things work out. When I started looking for a machine, there were no less than 25+ nos Vstrom's ( 1000) across the fruited plain. Now most are gone. OTOH, many if not most of the BMW's are still waiting for an owner!!!! THAT speaks volumes. I wonder if the "father-land" studies this or for that matter even cares?

I want to shout out a big thank you to all who responded here. Also a big thank you to the folks responsible for this site!
I am at peace and very satisfied. :) 🏍 👍
Why would the fatherland care when sales figures have been steadily climbing upwards for the last 9 years in a row? Last year sales figures were up 5.8% overall from 2018 and in 2019.

I would think the land of the rising sun should take notice that it is not uncommon for many of their dealers to have non-current NOS languishing on the showroom floor for years and the only way to get it to sell is for the dealer to offer steep discounts.
 

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Discussion Starter #177
Why would the fatherland care when sales figures have been steadily climbing upwards for the last 9 years in a row? Last year sales figures were up 5.8% overall from 2018 and in 2019.

I would think the land of the rising sun should take notice that it is not uncommon for many of their dealers to have non-current NOS languishing on the showroom floor for years and the only way to get it to sell is for the dealer to offer steep discounts.
Good point. Maybe my method of determining how fast one model is selling vs another is not accurate. All I know is many BMW's are languishing on the show room floor. I also saw how NOS BMW GS, 2017, 2018 's were not selling. Of course this is in my area of the country and money is super tight!! In addition single track machines here are not enjoying a renaissance. Way more bikes than wiling butts!
 

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Bikes regardless of OEM are not selling well nor have they been going on a few years, so much floor stock and in storage at every single dealer right now.......but yeah agree that HD is without question in the worst dilemma.
 

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Good point. Maybe my method of determining how fast one model is selling vs another is not accurate. All I know is many BMW's are languishing on the show room floor. I also saw how NOS BMW GS, 2017, 2018 's were not selling. Of course this is in my area of the country and money is super tight!! In addition single track machines here are not enjoying a renaissance. Way more bikes than wiling butts!

Could be that BMW dealers won't discount NOS?

Guy at work bought bought a new previous year GS 1250, the dealer wouldn't budge on the price. He did get 20% off on accessories if I remember right. He still didn't want to spend $4,000 on the OEM hard luggage though!

I told him "hey you joined the club buck up". He didn't think that was funny!
 

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The GS's series bikes are at least prior to the great American hoax had been all but selling out so why would dealerships drop the prices when they know if you don't buy the bike someone else will and in short order.

In early April a friend bought a new GS while under the Governors stay at home order. At the time his was the 31st sale that month.
 
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