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Discussion Starter #1
In another thread, there concerns about my safety when I fell over twice while practising these starts. In the course, It was a 5 foot box and I could pull it off with a Yamaha 250 but I went down twice trying to do it with a Strom. Right now, it's an 8 foot box and it's unaccaptable for city riding.

Well, okay.... how tight of a turn should I be able to make consistently with a V-Strom? 6 foot box? 5 foot box? 4 foot box?

If it's a stupid newbie question then forgive me, I'm a stupid newbie.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbhhD6MxC0w
 

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It's not a stupid question. Practice Practice Practice!

A 90 degree pull out is one of the tougher things to do for a new rider to a different bike especially a larger bike. The bigger the bike the more difficult it seems. But it only seems that way. Seriously.

The number one cause for a bike falling at low speed is lack of forward motion. I can hear the bike in the video, he's throttling up calmly but he's rolling on and looking where he wants to go. He will succeed every time.

How tight of a turn can you make with a V-Strom? Turn your handle bars all the way to one side. There's your answer.

Fact, you can ride in circles with any bike with the bars completely locked in either direction provided that you are moving and focus on where you are going. Always use throttle, feather your clutch and use rear brake; get that head turned around and keep your chin up, DO NOT look at the ground.

That's the tightest turn/circle you can ride. A 90... walk in the park after that.
 

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I agree with the above.

Practice your clutch/throttle/rear brake control. Buy Ride Like a Pro and practice those exercises IN ORDER. They are designed to teach muscle memory in a progressive manner.

I can execute immediate 90 degrees from a stop. It's a matter of starting the bike rolling - maybe 1ft forward and then cutting head/eyes/handlebars full left or right. That 1ft will also give you forward momentum and time needed to execute the 'bob' manuever explained in Ride Like a Pro videos. (Basically turning opposite the direction you want to turn BRIEFLY so that the bike follows a more naturally arc through the corner rather than trying to force the bike from a straight line onto a perpendicular line).

Practice. If you practice enough, you can do Standing 180s (u-turns from a stop).

But first start with the simple stuff....
 

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Best lesson I ever learned for bike and for car ... look where you want to go, not where you are going. i.e., Get your head up and turned.
 

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Yep, point your chin to the place you need to go. This gets your head around and keeps it looking out instead of down.
 

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Well, okay.... how tight of a turn should I be able to make consistently with a V-Strom? 6 foot box? 5 foot box? 4 foot box?
You should be able to make a turn from a stoip at full steering lock.
There's really nothing to it. You just need to get out of your comfortable routing of picking speed up before turning.

Here's some good advice:

- the bike doesn't fall because it is going slow or turning, the bike falls because you let go of it.
- clutch slip and rear brake drag are your friends
- look where you want to go.
- practice starting in a straight line and putting your feet on the pegs before you start moving.
- slow way down and try to keep your feet on the pegs for as long as you can after you have stopped the bike (still in a straight line)

Here's what to do:
- with left foot on the ground, and right foor on the brake, turn your steering to where you want to go.
- raise the rpm a bit and start slipping the clutch (you will be slipping it until your turn is complete)
- look FAR through your turn
- release pressure on the rear brake so as to allow the bike to move
- immediately lean the bike into the turn, and accelerate while releasing more rear brake. (you must stay completely off the front brake while practicing this)

There you go. Not only can you make sharp turns, but you can make them pretty quickly too.
 

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[...]It's a matter of starting the bike rolling - maybe 1ft forward and then cutting head/eyes/handlebars full left or right. That 1ft will also give you forward momentum and time needed to execute the 'bob' manuever explained in Ride Like a Pro videos.[...]
Uh, yeah. That 1 foot is not required and you can start the turn from a full stop if you lean the bike in just as you start moving.
 

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My palms get sweaty just reading these posts.

 

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Discussion Starter #10
Here's what to do:
- with left foot on the ground, and right foor on the brake, turn your steering to where you want to go.
- raise the rpm a bit and start slipping the clutch (you will be slipping it until your turn is complete)
- look FAR through your turn
- release pressure on the rear brake so as to allow the bike to move
- immediately lean the bike into the turn, and accelerate while releasing more rear brake. (you must stay completely off the front brake while practicing this)

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90 degree turns from a standing start? I see a fall or ten in my future! Mehh....I might as well buy a pillow for my ass......:green_lol:

You want to know something, I was told by one instructor NOT to use my rear brake and from another to use my rear brake. I didn't want to create a confrontation so I let it go. I tried the rear brake on the Yamaha 250 but on the Strom, I'm having a mental block. I think it's a "defensive reflex" of wanting to have quick exit off the bike that I have to train myself through. On the Yammy, it wasn't so much because of the lighter weight, I could quickly drop a foot to keep it up.

One of the critical things that I want to know. Are you "pushing" the front wheel into high friction? In other words, if you gad a bit of sand there, would you slip? I can't tell from the video if the high steering angle is a dive for balancing or a counter push from the front. Or both?

What I'm doing right now is simply starting a bike into an arc and nothing like what you describe. Needless to say, I'm going to need a lot of practice. Or it may be simply "getting it" and off we go.

Anywho....

I thank ALL who contributed. My ego goes on vacation when it comes to safety and from time to time, forgive me if I ask simple questions.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
My palms get sweaty just reading these posts.
I'm 56 and put two big shoulder blocks into the pavement. What's your excuse? :green_lol:

Actually, the falls weren't that bad. They were ATGATT pure reflex "fall and roll" that needed no TLC from the wife. On the other hand, I wont volunteer to do them for fun.
 

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I'm 56 and put two big shoulder blocks into the pavement. What's your excuse? :green_lol:

Actually, the falls weren't that bad. They were ATGATT pure reflex "fall and roll" that needed no TLC from the wife. On the other hand, I wont volunteer to do them for fun.
I'm 63 and a bona fide coward.

Oh, and then there was that low speed crash on a farm road with rocks about the size of grapefruit. Pain hurts.
 

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I think you guys are going about this all wrong:

As a Trials rider I make 90 degree turns all the time. It has nothing to do with "lean" or "speed" .....it's balance.

What you need to practice first is standing on the pegs with the bike at a stop - don't even start the engine. Once you can stand on the pegs (or sit on the seat for that matter) for a good 30 seconds you are ready for the next step.

With your feet on the pegs, stopped, let the clutch out and move "straight" forward..... stop after 3 feet and balance for 30 seconds. Repeat this going up and down your driveway or in a parking lot.

Once you are comfortable stopping and just sitting there balanced, you are ready to try turning.

You steer the bike with foot pressure on the pegs....not the handle bars..... Try gentle turns and work your way up to full lock.

Now, have said all of this: I can do it on just about any Trials bike....but have not tired it on the Wee.....and don't plan on it.
 

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I think you guys are going about this all wrong:

As a Trials rider I make 90 degree turns all the time. It has nothing to do with "lean" or "speed" .....it's balance.
Smooth application of power is part of balance. A bit more power tries to stand the bike up. A bit less power lets the bike lean over more. Jerky application of power means a close encounter with Mr. Ground.
 

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I think you guys are going about this all wrong:

As a Trials rider I make 90 degree turns all the time. It has nothing to do with "lean" or "speed" .....it's balance.

What you need to practice first is standing on the pegs with the bike at a stop - don't even start the engine. Once you can stand on the pegs (or sit on the seat for that matter) for a good 30 seconds you are ready for the next step.

With your feet on the pegs, stopped, let the clutch out and move "straight" forward..... stop after 3 feet and balance for 30 seconds. Repeat this going up and down your driveway or in a parking lot.

Once you are comfortable stopping and just sitting there balanced, you are ready to try turning.

You steer the bike with foot pressure on the pegs....not the handle bars..... Try gentle turns and work your way up to full lock.

Now, have said all of this: I can do it on just about any Trials bike....but have not tired it on the Wee.....and don't plan on it.
Remind me to never slow race you:thumbup:
 

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When you master 90 degrees head out to Harpers Ferry, WV. Once there go east on Rt 340 and turn 170 degrees right onto Chestnut Hill Road. It's one of my favorite local roads. Don't forget to add 55 MPH traffic behind you on the single lane Rt 340, and of course a car exiting Chestnut Hill turning left.

I'm pretty confident in my slow riding abilities while turning the bars to the stops. But I will often ride past this turn when I'm facing the scenario just described. Sometimes discretion really is the better part of valor.

 

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Discussion Starter #20
Oh great, now I'm going to practise.....and fall on three methods...:green_lol:

I'm way too much of a newbie to argue with anyone but...the motorcross bike in the video is about 200 pounds lighter then the Wee. Maybe I'm wrong but that start-off lean angle alone is on the border of tipping over on a Wee.

I mountain bike on some really tough forest trails. MAYBE I could do the same on a 180 pound trail bike. But I need to grow a pair of bowling balls to do even 10% of that on a Wee.
 
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