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Maybe I'm just real new with DL650 but I've noticed the wheel wants to turn in sharply (both left or right turns) on a slow speed turn (like at intersection). On any other higher speed turn AOK. Any suggestions where to start looking. The previous owner had dropped it twice as I replaced the flush front turn signals with Tuff Lights, but forks do not look damaged. I put a forkbrace on it and no change.

Thanks, Boz
 

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Two things spring to mind. The first is easy and it is the front tyre pressure.

The second is that you are tense during the turn and are counter-steering which makes the bike feel like it is turning in too sharp, which makes you more tense.
 

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Breathe, relax, slip the clutch and drag the rear brake a bit. These bikes are top-heavy, so low speed maneuvers can be tricky. If you try to counter steer at these speeds the bike will drop into the turn fast. If that happens, add some throttle to stand it up.


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And look in the direction you are turning. Don't look at the ground.
 

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And look in the direction you are turning. Don't look at the ground.
And, do this by turning your head...not just your eyes. If your head isn't turning to face directly at the point you want to hit, you're not doing it correctly.

One other thing, which I learned in a Motorcycle Safety Course, weight the OUTside edge of your seat when you turn sharply at low speeds...it helps keep the bike more upright, which keeps you from feeling that it is going to tip over inward.
 

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The Dl's are actually a very nimble bike for slow speed manuvering. As previously stated, turning your head is a key factor but momentum is also important. Always look up and to the direction you want to go, never down. And of course leaning the bike factors in greatly. If your troubles persist I would suggest enroling in a class such as Ride Like A Pro in Texas https://www.ridelikeapro.com/locations/houston
Your confidence and abilities will soar
 

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Weight to the outside of the turn on low speed turns keeps the rider more upright, not the bike.
 

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And, do this by turning your head...not just your eyes. If your head isn't turning to face directly at the point you want to hit, you're not doing it correctly.

One other thing, which I learned in a Motorcycle Safety Course, weight the OUTside edge of your seat when you turn sharply at low speeds...it helps keep the bike more upright, which keeps you from feeling that it is going to tip over inward.
You are correct in that weighting the outside of the bike aids in cornering however it is not to keep the bike upright as in perpendicular to the riding surface, it is to keep your center of mass over the bikes center of mass. The bike needs to lean, even in slower manuvering. Watch this motor officers head snap, body position changes and bike lean through his manuvers
This is quite impressive | Facebook
 

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Remember this discussion is about low speed tight turns. Counterweighting, as the process of body weight to the outside of the turn is called, eats up ground clearance at higher speeds and is not good form.
 

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All the above about counterweighting, slipping the clutch, and dragging the rear brake are great suggestions.

When you're choosing where to look, for faster speed turns, I look where I want to be. That means I had to train myself not to look at the obstacles, but look just left or just right of the obstacle. For example, in the middle of a curve I see a pothole. If I focus on the pothole, I'm going to hit the pothole. If I focus to the left or right of the pothole, the bike will go to the left or right of the pothole and I will miss it.

For SLOW speed turns, you need to look PAST where you want to be. Essentially, if I'm making a right hand u-turn, I crank my head over and try to look BEHIND me while I'm turning. All the way through the turn. So at the end of the turn, I'm not looking straight, but still a little to the right of the line I want. And I keep that head angle. Cause naturally I want to look behind me and as I turn I want to see the line or curb and want to see how close I am to it. But you'll learn that if you keep your head cranked all the way, you WILL miss that curb by a good foot. Trust in the bike to have a good turn radius. Cause this bike is pretty damned nimble.

Alexi
 

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Remember this discussion is about low speed tight turns. Counterweighting, as the process of body weight to the outside of the turn is called, eats up ground clearance at higher speeds and is not good form.
Absolutely. Counterweighting is counterproductive, so to speak, in the majority of street riding (dirt is another issue) I believe the OP's problem may be trying to turn the bars without much bike lean thereby forcing the front wheel to want to pinch inward. Depending on the radius and speed of his turn, counterweighting may not be necessary
However when addressing slow speed, shorter radius turns, counterweighting is an important componet. For achieving full lock, full lean turns as in the linked video, it's vital, but most likely wouldn't help in the OP's case
 

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Weight to the outside of the turn on low speed turns keeps the rider more upright, not the bike.
This ^


Normal/high speed turns: Move torso to the inside of the turn. Counter-steer.

Slow speed turns: Move torso to the outside of the turn (counter-balance). Steer.


Also:
- Slip the clutch.
- Drag the rear brake a bit... this helps a lot.
- Turn your whole head to the exit of the turn.





Note: I find it easier to make U-turns on my heavy DL1000 than I do on my lighter SV650. Maybe it's because of the more upright body position on the Vee. :confused:
 

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Note: I find it easier to make U-turns on my heavy DL1000 than I do on my lighter SV650. Maybe it's because of the more upright body position on the Vee. :confused:
Sport bikes traditionally have a lesser degree of handlebar lock to lock than other bikes, requiring them to be at a greater lean angle to compensate durring slow manuvering. Basically that necessates the rider to transition into a turn faster, harder and deaper (closer to the ground) than when on a bike with greater bar rotation in order to acheieve the same radius. Wheelbase distance, rake, etc., also have a part in this. Again, this is all regarding slow manuvers
Generally the bike weight has more to do with the difficulty in repetitious transition of movement (throwing the bike from side to side) when practicing than anything else. It's much more tiring running my 900lb HD Ultra through a course than my DL. Your forward body lean on the SV certainly plays a part, although it is a lighter bike.
 

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Since two pointed out my error, I couldn't respond to one and leave out the other. Yep, sitting a bit more heavy on the outside of the seat in a slow speed turn keeps the body more upright, allowing the bike to tilt more (if needed), without feeling like the whole deal is going to drop to the inside.

BTW, I don't think I do this except in slow speed turns...1st gear, creeping along. When I re-read the OP, it makes me think he's feeling this at faster speeds (10 mph and faster), since he's going through an intersection. I don't feel this bike is very top-heavy...could be because I recently had a KLR with a 7 gallon tank!
 

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Boz, could you be turning before you've put on enough power? Try some very slow parking lot practice. Without touching the throttle you'll find that slightly squeezing in on the clutch causes the bike to drop into the turn, and slightly letting out the clutch stands the bike up. You might just need a small change in your timing to give it a bit of clutch and throttle earlier in your slow turn.

A motorcycle does not need to lean into a slow turn, but it'll turn sharper if you do lean it over by shifting the rider's weight to the outside. Try it with a light mc or a bicycle...bars hard over, walk,it around in a circle. Lean it over and walk around in a smaller circle.
 

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Boz, could you be turning before you've put on enough power? Try some very slow parking lot practice. Without touching the throttle you'll find that slightly squeezing in on the clutch causes the bike to drop into the turn, and slightly letting out the clutch stands the bike up. You might just need a small change in your timing to give it a bit of clutch and throttle earlier in your slow turn.

A motorcycle does not need to lean into a slow turn, but it'll turn sharper if you do lean it over by shifting the rider's weight to the outside. Try it with a light mc or a bicycle...bars hard over, walk,it around in a circle. Lean it over and walk around in a smaller circle.
That's one of the biggest mistakes beginners make while learning slow maneuvers, depressing the clutch lever slightly while executing a turn. The consequence being loss of momentum and generally a dropped bike. It is easily detected by the audible sound of increased RPM's as the throttle remains in the same position while the lever is depressed while in motion.
As the OP is having trouble in tighter slow turns I wouldn't recomend him depressing the clutch lever any further at this time.However your statemenet stands true and practicing releasing the lever slightly to pull up and out of a turn or circle is a wise idea.
 

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The bike has a center of gravity and the rider has a center of gravity and what matters is the combined center of gravity, to keep the bike balanced, and you can add centrifical force to stand the bike up by simply accelerating. The video was impressive.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Wow lots of great information and very well delivered. Thanks to one and all.
Maybe I was too simple in my splaining my problem. Having ridden since 66 on many different bikes and having taken Motorcycle Safety Training class and the ERC 8 times most of your help was a great refresher and I hope others will garner some ideas.

The problem is an un-natural falling into the turn (L or R) beyond what I've experienced on any bike other than a HD with a springer frontend at low speeds. I'm looking for ideas on where to start looking in the hardware on the DL650. The 09 DL650 I had for 6 months (should have kept),did not demonstrate this tendency. Tire pressure is correct (never though of that but checked just in case). Could bad steering head bearings or not tightened correctly also cause this behavior?
Thanks
 

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...The problem is an un-natural falling into the turn (L or R) beyond what I've experienced on any bike other than a HD with a springer frontend at low speeds. I'm looking for ideas on where to start looking in the hardware on the DL650. The 09 DL650 I had for 6 months (should have kept),did not demonstrate this tendency. Tire pressure is correct (never though of that but checked just in case). Could bad steering head bearings or not tightened correctly also cause this behavior?
Thanks
Has this bike been lowered by any chance? If so what was done?

..Tom
 
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