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I have sniggly little suspicion that changing to sintered pads and stainless steel brake lines is cheaper and easier than switching to 4 pot calipers and gives the same improvement in feel.

What say all you who have done this? Are people switching to 4 pot calipers just wasting their time and money or is there real braking performance in distance stopped to be gained. Opinions of people selling brake caliper adapters not needed.
 

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I have had both the DL 1000 and the DL 650 ( actually two DL 650's ) with HH sintered pads. The DL 1000 had stainless braided brake lines. Yes, the HH pads give a much better bite and feel. Yes, the braided lines give a more firm feel but not much real difference in performance.

Neither of which are even in the same league as the 4 pot caliper upgrade. About like Tim Tebow in a big league baseball game.......

The only negative I can see with the 4 pot calipers is the need to get them bled properly. Which you would also have to do with braided lines. It took me a couple days to get the air worked out of mine. Once you do that, there is not much lever travel and the instant you touch the lever you feel the brakes bite.

You just have to ride the same bike back to back to realize the improvement.
 
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4 Pot Better

Although, It's hard to say as I went from OEM on a DL650K7 to SS braided lines, Tokio 4 pot calipers, HH sintered pads, OEM MCyl. After doing this, and ex brake-in, I had a very strong brake dive and changed the front suspension substantially. Now, the dive is gone and the brakes seem much stronger in near max perf stops, and ordinary stops require less force. The main thing is that once the front is compressed and you keep adding more brake, the 4 pot keeps adding a lot of torque when the OEM 2 pot seems to stall out or seemed limited in the force it could apply. I too had to bleed plenty to get all the air out but that's ok. I got the calipers off a SV 1000 from EBay for about $220 but I found cheaper setups if I was willing to do complete overhaul of the calipers. With new lines, new pads, new dual banjo valve, 2 cans of new fluid, the whole mod was a little over $400.00. It seems a worthwhile safety upgrade. I do not think the braided SS lines made any difference. I believe OEM or SS lines carry the fluid in a rigid teflon tube and thus the SS braid adds nothing except the outside of the brake lines maybe more resistant to abrasion, although when I removed the OEM lines I never noted any sign of abrasion. When I bought the SS lines, I did not know this.
 

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Kinda think

Most of the advantage of the upgrades is in 'feel' rather than shorter stopping distance. Since stopping distance is for the most part a function of tire traction (if you're doing it right) rather than outright brake power (excluding fade from repeated hard use) , I'd guess you can stop with the stock setup nearly as short (with practice) as with the upgraded systems, but you'll need to squeeze the lever a good deal harder. In racing situations the upgraded brakes may provide better predictability in marginal traction situations (trail braking). But mostly it is a matter of two fingers on the lever vs. four. Some would say that the better initial 'bite' will shorten distances, but if you practice getting on the brakes hard, immediately, with the stock setup I doubt the difference would be much. As an aside, if you ride much on low-traction surfaces (dirt, gravel) that initial 'bite' might lead to unintentional lock-ups. And if an inexperienced rider tries a panic stop with one if the low-effort setups, might see lockup there too.

FWIW, if you find yourself braking hard regularly, in anything but a racing situation, you might wanna reconsider your riding style.
 

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Yes, the HH pads give a much better bite and feel. Yes, the braided lines give a more firm feel but not much real difference in performance.

Neither of which are even in the same league as the 4 pot caliper upgrade.
Agreed.
SS lines show an improvement, IMHO, only when the old factory lines have lost their stiffness. Replacing new, or so, factory composite lines with SS, really there is no improvement. HH pads? Who doesn't run them. HH pads aren't going to transform any bike braking system.
I did the SS and HH because they came from PO. For me not worth the effort or money.
Nissan CBR calipers and a DL1000 master cylinder on my 650---now--- I really feel no difference from a modern Beemer Brembo or a Honda Nissan set-up when I switch back and forth. I would estimate that just adding the Nissan calipers w/HH added about 25% +/- more braking power, adding the 1000 MC created more feel and the lever under max pressure never get closer to the grip than about an inch. Huge difference from stock. Real brakes.
 

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Wave rotors make a massive difference as well. Even with organic pads my DL stops better than it did stock with wave rotors.

I'll agree that 4 pot pistons are better in terms of effort, but unless you have weak hands you'll be able to stand the bike on it's nose with either setup.
 

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What say all you who have done this? Are people switching to 4 pot calipers just wasting their time and money or is there real braking performance in distance stopped to be gained. Opinions of people selling brake caliper adapters not needed.

Out of 6 replies, 3 have not used the 4 pot caliper conversion and don't think it much of a difference maker.

Out of 6 replies, 3 HAVE used the 4 pot caliper conversion and all seem to think it a major improvement.

If you don't think there is a difference in stopping distance, you have not done a before and after with a V STrom going from stock to 4 pot calipers. I will leave it at that. For the record again, I DID switch to HH pads on the stock calipers hoping to gain braking force. Which I did, but NOTHING like the 4 pot gives.
 

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Out of 6 replies, 3 have not used the 4 pot caliper conversion and don't think it much of a difference maker.

Out of 6 replies, 3 HAVE used the 4 pot caliper conversion and all seem to think it a major improvement.

If you don't think there is a difference in stopping distance, you have not done a before and after with a V STrom going from stock to 4 pot calipers. I will leave it at that. For the record again, I DID switch to HH pads on the stock calipers hoping to gain braking force. Which I did, but NOTHING like the 4 pot gives.
Count me out either way: I marely pointed out that OEM Tokico pads are HH rated and while judging by other bike experience EBCs HH are stronger they're stronger not by much maybe ~10% give or take. EBCs are also grabby at the beginning, at least until enough material embeds into rotors.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
The Vee2 has great braking and uses a 4 pot caliper. I wish I had first hand experience with the change from 2 to 4, but I'll go with the experience of those that have and make another batch of 4 pot caliper adapters.
 

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My '07A has 4 pot, my '16 has stock w/HH sintered. I did a test in ABS mode with both bikes at 50 mph. The difference was less than a car length(around 15'). Even though that is nothing to sneeze at I decided to forgo the 4 pots on the '15.
 

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I agree with Terry in post #2 and Sin in post #5. Get the 4 piston calipers. Forego the stainless hoses unless the stock hoses are deteriorated.
 

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My '07A has 4 pot, my '16 has stock w/HH sintered. I did a test in ABS mode with both bikes at 50 mph. The difference was less than a car length(around 15'). Even though that is nothing to sneeze at I decided to forgo the 4 pots on the '15.
Thanks for the input, after reading this and other brake threads I am leaning more towards 4 pot.

To be honest I barely use brakes; prefer to ride in manner which doesn't rely much on braking. Have had bikes which ha gone 60k without needing replacement pads. Also find Glee brakes adequate for most part. So why? need more for 2up loaded emergency situations, just in case.
 

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My '07A has 4 pot, my '16 has stock w/HH sintered. I did a test in ABS mode with both bikes at 50 mph. The difference was less than a car length(around 15'). Even though that is nothing to sneeze at I decided to forgo the 4 pots on the '15.
15 feet at only 50 mph is LIFE vs DEATH. If you could measure your total braking distance you would see how 15 ft is a big percentage of that distance. I suspect the difference will go up dramatically as speed increases. And that is why I want the 4 pot calipers. They just start braking hard quicker. With confidence.
 

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RS, you are correct, they are better. I might add them someday, but for now I think the brakes are adequate for my riding style.
 

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I hope to not come across as meaning anyone MUST go to 4 pot calipers. Just like helmets and gear, ride what you are comfortable with.
 

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The brakes on my XT with stock pads are better than either of my previous 1000's, and I had HH pads on them too. I figure my XT with HH will only get better, I see no need "for me" to ever install 4 pots.
 

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I will be doing this upgrade next summer, September through June is my riding season so I do all this stuff in summer. Going to do new 4 pots with HH pads and the suspension at the same time. This bike is just too awesome to ever sell, so a few upgrades here and there are ok.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I have been away doing some research again. I just love researching, but then I don't fish, bowl, or dance and you gotta do something.

RS convinced me to make another run at coming up with better solution than caliper adapters and used calipers. I don't know if it will be successful and if it is "someone" will be waiting to copy it, but here goes anyway.
 

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I have been away doing some research again. I just love researching, but then I don't fish, bowl, or dance and you gotta do something.

RS convinced me to make another run at coming up with better solution than caliper adapters and used calipers. I don't know if it will be successful and if it is "someone" will be waiting to copy it, but here goes anyway.
Come up with a way to mount Brembos....that would flat out be awesome.
 
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