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The rear axle nut popped off last night while I was torquing it up after adjusting the chain. Nearly at 72 lbs and bang off it went. Surprised the heck out of me. New axle, washer, and nut now on order. I think some anti seize and less torque is in order from now on. Lesson learned.



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Are they making things cheaper nowadays? I've never had this happen in 42 yrs of riding. Chain adjustments and tire changes too numerous to count. In the old days didn't even use a torque wrench, just "tight as heck".
 

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Make sure you get the newer non castellated lock nut!! It has a lot more thread area and will be less likely to gall. OEM standard on the newer 650.

Check e-bay for a used axle.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Make sure you get the newer non castellated lock nut!! It has a lot more thread area and will be less likely to gall. OEM standard on the newer 650.



Check e-bay for a used axle.


Will do. That cotter pin on the nut probably saved my keester the other day doing 70 per... I’ll check ebay thanks.


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Blau, why would you buy a used axle when you can easily buy a new one that hasnt been torqued?

Rail, '05 DL650. 13 years old, how many times do you think that axle nut has been torqued? Nothing's forever, and metal fatigue does happen. Earlier in the year I had a long conversation with the Suzuki factory service rep. The factory shop manual shows the non-castellated nut to replaced every time it's moved. Lawyer/liability thing. He recommends using the factory torque setting with a small amount of bearing grease on the threads and not reducing the torque setting at all. At $25 per axle nut, I will not be replacing mine every time I adjust the chain. But I will be replacing it when I feel the need, as in major services and tire changes--depending on the condition of the axle nut and axle shaft threads.
Basically, Suzuki is viewing the axle nut as an expendable wear item.
 

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... The factory shop manual shows the non-castellated nut to replaced every time it's moved. Lawyer/liability thing. He recommends using the factory torque setting with a small amount of bearing grease on the threads and not reducing the torque setting at all. At $25 per axle nut, I will not be replacing mine every time I adjust the chain. But I will be replacing it when I feel the need, as in major services and tire changes--depending on the condition of the axle nut and axle shaft threads.
Basically, Suzuki is viewing the axle nut as an expendable wear item.
I think it's because of the self-locking metal strip in there which probably can weaken with repeated cycling. There's probably some number of safe "cycles", but how would you ever keep track of that, so it gets a "replace every time" label. They recommend the same with the rear suspension bolts. While I've never replaced an axle nut, I did go ahead and put in new bolts when I replaced the Gixxus shock since it was such a small part of the overall cost.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
New axle on order.. with a few spare nuts..

Thanks all for the advice. Some of us noobies rely on the information here. Always very helpful. Thanks again.


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I think MAZ called it right in post #6. Oldest I've had was 10 yrs, 86000 miles. The threads were starting to look a bit flattened, may have failed before long. I guess the best idea is, like any other part, inspect it carefully each time, and replace if it's questionable.

So the Suzuki rep says use bearing grease? Someone with some knowledge of the subject please explain the difference between that and anti-sieze.
 

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Antiseize is basically an oil with powdered aluminum or copper--soft metals which serve to prevent the oil from running, and the alum or copper act as a sort of bearing surface between internal and external threads. It also serves to prevent corrosion between threads. 2 different metals in an acidic environment leads to electrolysis, and a sort of "slow-motion welding" between threads. Grease is just a heavy lubricant that resists running.
In the past, I would use the regular aluminum antiseize--primarily on exhaust studs, bolts, and nuts. About 15 years ago I switched to the copper antiseize. Even though most spark plug manufacturers caution against the use of antiseize on their plugs( can cause a problem with heat transfer and interfere with the plug's ground circuit) many still use it. The aluminum type would turn to concrete, makeit difficult to remove plugs that had been left in aluminum heads for far too long an interval. The copper type stays wet for seemingly forever. The copper type is also referred to as "Brake Lubricant", and works well on brake shoe contact areas of the brake backing plate, brake caliper sliding pins, and the steel brake pad point of contact with the caliper. Permatex is the brand I primarily use.
On motorcycles it works especially well on exhaust studs, exhaust clamps, anywhere heat and/or environment can lead to corrosion. Applying it during assembly or reassembly in might take but a few seconds, but can easily save you from anger, frustration, and added expense during a later disassembly.
 

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Not sure if I’ve ever heard of aluminum-based anti-seize hardening up like that. How long of a time/mile period are you talking about here? Thanks for the warning.
 

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Charlie, most of the time the aluminum-based anti-seize compound caused problems were with spark plugs in aluminum cylinder heads. Even when replaced at the recommended service intervals sometimes the plugs would take considerable effort to not just break loose, but the full unthreading process was difficult. This was noted in all the types of Mazda engines I dealt with daily, including the rotaries. Same with Subarus and Nissans. Once we switched over to copper-based anti-seize, we never had problems again. If I removed a spark plug with aluminum compound, the anti-seize in the threads was dry like an almost-set cement. The copper compound would be wet 30K-60K miles later. Exhaust studs was another example--dry after several heat cycles, the copper would be wet a year or more later.
With my spark plug example, that may not have been a problem with the steel spark plug shells threaded into cast iron cylinder heads like I worked on in the '60's and prior engines up til aluminum cylinder heads and blocks became the material of choice. Truth be tiold, we never used anti-seize in those cast iron engines except for exhaust studs. But when aluminum heads became the norm, all of a sudden spark plugs would be difficult to remove, or pull the threads of the cylinder head during removal. Then antiseize became the the thing to use in spark plug service.
Then we started having some problems even with that. Then spark plug replacement intervals went from 15K to 30K to 60K, and now many dont recommend changing plugs til 100K miles. In some engines, leave a plug in aluminum head that long is an invitation to seized spark plugs.
If I use antiseize on anything, it's always the copper type.
 

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Wow, I’ll keep that in mind. I’ve never seen that happen, but I don’t have nearly the experience working on motors that you do, either. Thanks for the reply!
 

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This is mostly a straightforward case of the spec'd torque being too high. 50-55ft-lbs is sufficient, even without the anti seize, and 40-45 is good with it. The rear sprocket nut torque spec is too high also.

Properly torqued, fatigue shouldn't be an issue. I raced SV's for years, both endurance and sprints, with the same axle/nut type as the 650 Strom. Had the rear wheel on and off many hundreds of times with no issues. No torque wrench either. :)
 
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