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snipped by STC......... How long do you expect your Stroms to last? - until I hit something) does any of this oil talk rally matter in the real world? I think so

..Tom
How many of those Porches you sell and service are running synthetic oil?

I am in total agreement with your comments about water cooled engines being easier on everything, including oil, than air cooled. Oil is the blood in our engines.
 

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How many of those Porches you sell and service are running synthetic oil?

I am in total agreement with your comments about water cooled engines being easier on everything, including oil, than air cooled. Oil is the blood in our engines.
All of the Porsche (since 1993) run synthetic from the factory but I'm pretty sure the VW and Audis I was selling in the 80's were not running synthetic and that was the era where they spoke of 140°c oil temp being the area where oil starts breaking down.

(Good plan to try and avoid hitting something! :) My total Strom riding of my own Stroms adds up to 409,969 miles / 659,781 km as of my last fill up. So far I've been lucky.)

..Tom
 

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Certainly my 2006 DL650 which had about 185,000 km / 115,000 miles when I took it to Death Valley had no issues riding in 120+°F temperature and had no issue heading home from Utah to near Toronto, Ontario running at 80 to 90 mph on the interstate all day long in temperatures in the 80's to100°f. (Like many DL650's it used oil at high speed slabbing. That didn't change much in the heat.)

Anyway I have ridden two of my Stroms over 200,000 km with no issues so there certainly doesn't seem to be any issues with oil. (I know that isn't even close to high mileage compared to some out there. How long do you expect your Stroms to last?) does any of this oil talk rally matter in the real world?

..Tom
Tom, when you were running in DV in 120+ F, at high speed cruise, your engine wasn't really working too hard at keeping itself cool. Lots of air flow. Imagine riding off road, low speed, soft sand or gravel, under those temps, then your cooling system will definitely be taxed. Coolant temp will easily be above 215 F, if not 220+, your cooling fan running to keep it under 230, which means your oil is running hot for long periods. Running it like that for long periods often, which can happen in a congested urban environment in summer, that degrades oil much quicker. Not good for stators either. If you spend a lot of time off road, in congested urban environment with high ambient temps, you definitely do not want to extend oil change intervals. The engine will appreciate it. Not saying it won't last if you ignore it. But it certainly won't hurt to change earlier.
 

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@OCL I wasn't running at high speeds in Death Valley. Probably in the 55 to 65 mph range. Heading home in the interstate was a max of 100⁰f but cooled down to about 80⁰f when I got near Chicago but I was typically traveling at 80 to 90 mph until close to Chicago.

Doesn't take away from your point though.

Although one point I've been trying to make is that oil temperatures on Liquid cooled bikes with coolant/oil coolers are not going to have the high temperatures in traffic as the fan will keep the coolant temps down which will keep the oil temps down

..Tom
 

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@OCL
Although one point I've been trying to make is that oil temperatures on Liquid cooled bikes with coolant/oil coolers are not going to have the high temperatures in traffic as the fan will keep the coolant temps down which will keep the oil temps down

..Tom
Oh yeah I'm with you. I had a DR650 (air and oil cooled engine). It had an external oil cooler as well that sat in the breeze. I hooked up a Cylinder Head Temp sensor to the DR650's motor I could see the CHT on the fly on my aftermarket digital gauge cluster. The CHT temp definitely varied depending on ambient temp, RPM, vehicle speed, etc. I could tell when the motor was working hard to stay cool, or not. Under ideal conditions, the CHT temp would sit around 280-300 F. But at extended high speed running on hot days, or extended idling, or off road riding, the CHT would rise up to 320-340+ F. Keep in mind CHT doesn't compare to coolant temp. This is to your point, liquid cooled motors are able to regulate engine heat against the effects of ambient temps and engine loads much better.
 

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Oh yeah I'm with you. I had a DR650 (air and oil cooled engine). It had an external oil cooler as well that sat in the breeze. I hooked up a Cylinder Head Temp sensor to the DR650's motor I could see the CHT on the fly on my aftermarket digital gauge cluster. The CHT temp definitely varied depending on ambient temp, RPM, vehicle speed, etc. I could tell when the motor was working hard to stay cool, or not. Under ideal conditions, the CHT temp would sit around 280-300 F. But at extended high speed running on hot days, or extended idling, or off road riding, the CHT would rise up to 320-340+ F. Keep in mind CHT doesn't compare to coolant temp. This is to your point, liquid cooled motors are able to regulate engine heat against the effects of ambient temps and engine loads much better.
Yeah I'm familiar with CHT. My little ultralight airplane had a Rotax 503 which is a 500 cc two stroke air cooled engine. It had the CHT and it had active cooling unlike a bike. I forget the numbers but you could definitely see the CHT change with load (climbing,) settle down with steady cruise and drop when throttling down. IIRC there was something on the liquid cooled versions that you had to watch the CHT while coming in for landings so it didn't get thermal shock (I think it was called) where the motor could cool down so much it would actually seize.

..Tom
 

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I had a Mitsubishi Delica van for a few year. 2.5l turbo diesel. Gutless little thing but a great van in every other way. They were prone to head gasket failure if pushed too hard so installing an aftermarket Exhaust Gas Temp gauge was almost a must. It was better at monitoring for speed than the speedo. Amazing what a small change in how the motor was working resulted in big fluctuations of EGT. Should never have sold it.
Wheel Tire Car Land vehicle Vehicle
 

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Nice van!
It was aweome. 4 wd with a 2 sp transfer case. I once had snow coming up over the windshield and it just kept chuggin along. I bought it for a very dear friend and when she passed, I just couldn't bear to drive it anymore.
 

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Discussion Starter · #53 ·
I haven't tuned out, but rather letting the discussion reach a conclusion, but seems like a fool's errand :p.

Regardless, I see the point in - following the schedule doesn't hurt, but like a few pointed out - I am fine following the dealer schedule as far as I am in the city, it is all about "on the road for longer than prescribed service intervals".

Here in India we do not/rarely reach the 80-100 KPH kind of speeds (atleast if you are a responsible rider). Even if you manage to somehow avoid the traffic, the roads rarely allow you to get to such speeds. If the roads are pure spotless tarmac there are always cows, dogs or somebody's kid just brake checking us all the time. In 2019 a couple of friends and I carried a bottle of Dalwhinnie 15 with us on a 4 day trip - the premise being that anyone crosses 125Kph and we finish the bottle. We finished the bottle on the last day of our trip - and only because we didn't want to carry it back.

My question always was - how long can I push beyond the prescribed service interval while I am on a trip - safely, not causing any long term damage to the bike (regular day to maintenance - like chain adjustment not withstanding).
 

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Think about it for a minute the service intervals are just a number in a book, my book has the same number as everybody else, my bike gets a true flogging, lots of dirt roads and steep hills, many many burnouts and wheel stands, 2 up holidays with heaps of gear loaded on, then there is the guy that rides to his local café everyday to get a coffee, he is told to service his bike at the same time as I'm told to service mine.

I ride with a guy that has a Tenere, he spends a lot of time in outback Australia so he services his bike early and often, that makes sense but it did not help, the compression got so low the bike would not start, the valves were dusted because Yamaha had not fitted the right air filter from new.
 

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how long can I push beyond the prescribed service interval while I am on a trip - safely, not causing any long term damage to the bike (regular day to maintenance - like chain adjustment not withstanding).
If you can get good quality oil and filter, I would not be afraid to go 12,000 kms between changes.

Interesting the difference in intervals depending on country. Here is some info as to maybe why that is.

As someone said, "oil is the lifeblood of an engine". For sure you are not going to do any harm in changing it more often than needed but I doubt you are going to hurt anything with the longer interval providing you use quality products. What I don't get is not changing the filter with every oil change.
 

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Right-on! I went on a 3 day atv(4 wheeler) ride with a bunch of guys. One guy had a brand new Yamaha,zero Kms.For some reason he wanted to check the wheel nuts.EVERY ONE OF THEM where finger tight. I figure dealerships give the PDI TO THE JUNIOR DUDES.What could go wrong, right?
Another buddy worked a bike shop when in high school.Bike in for valve adjust service etc.”Throw in a set of spark plugs & take er for a rip . OK—OK!
 

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@drrod

Filters actually get more effective at filtering until they stop filtering altogether. Te question is when does that stop filtering point happen? If and when it does happen the bypass valve lets oil go by so there isn't oil starvation.

I generally do oil filter changes either when I change oil at 12,000 km (7,500 miles) or at double that depending on my mood.

..Tom
 

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My comment regarding filters was not about them stop filtering, but more toward why dump a cup of dirty oil into the new? Not that big of deal I know but I guess because I stretch intervals/age a bit, it is not something I will do.
 

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Discussion Starter · #59 ·
I, as well can't live with the thought of old filter/a pint of old oil, to mix with new oil. It is a cheap part anyway so I always change the filter when oil is changed. More than anything it is mental peace.
 

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I think at least part of the reason some mfrs specify oil filter changes every other or every third oil change is to help keep dirty filters out of landfills. Our county recycling center will accept them, but curbside pickup won't; probably true in many communities, so many DIY dirty filters end up in the garbage can or Dumpster.
 
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