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Making several changes - Correct order please

2401 Views 17 Replies 11 Participants Last post by  richw
I'm working out the kinks on a fairly new to me 06 1K Vee. I'm sinking a significant amount of money into it with farkles and stuff. So far I've added the new Givi Trekker 3 piece cases, an Easter Beaver fuse block, a Baldwin Saddles seat and a few other things. It is getting there but the engine is annoyingly un-smooth.

In the upcoming October 2011 issue of Motorcycle Consumer News there will be a review of the Trekkers and Adventure MotoStuff mount I wrote along with pictures of my DL.

I also have a set of Leo Vince cans on the way. I've got a set of Battle Wings in the garage waiting for my new Ingersol Rand compressor to arrive. I have the HF tire changer and change my own tires.

Here are my current questions. I haven't checked the TPS or the done a TBS yet. I'm assuming I should wait until I install the Leo Vinces. I'll need to build the $4 sync tool. I had a mercury one and got rid of it when I bought a SK tool for syncing the carbs on my ST1100. If anyone is familiar with the SK tool is it possible to use that to sync the throttle bodies on the DL? I haven't had the air cleaner off and don't know what it looks like under there.

So my questions is... Once the exhaust are installed which should come first the checking the TPS or TBS? I've done all the work on my other bikes but this is the first fuel injected bike so I'm hesitant to start pulling hoses and turning adjustment screws until I'm clear about what I'm doing. I do have a service manual.

If I knew of a dealership in south central New Jersey I could trust to have competent techs I'd be tempted to take it to them. But I haven't had any that come highly recommended and I read too many stories about the bike coming out of the dealer worse than it went in.

Thanks in advance for any advice.
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Should I wait to do it until I have the pipes installed? I'm leaving for a week long ride from NJ to western NC, Tennessee, etc. I usually don't like to make big changes so close to leaving for a trip but I'd like the pipes on.
 

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I would definitely pull the air filter box, check all the hoses & caps, then run an extended set from the vacuum ports for balancing the throttle bodies to make your life easier next time. Then I'd balance the secondaries followed by the throttle bodes themselves. It's not hard just be patient and thorough. When you do the TBS balance check them at different rpm ranges, not just one rpm.

It will most likely smooth things out but you may conclude a PCIII (or Yosh box fix etc.) might be a better farkle than the LeoVince pipes. Not knocking the pipes (got a LeoVince on my KLR), but the remapping will make you happier, it's a night and day difference in my experience with my '06.

I did things in the order I suggested and each was an incremental improvement with the PCIII remap as the crown jewel in terms of obtaining a smooth running engine.

For reference I used a Motion Pro liquid tube balancing tool. My old mercury based Carb Stix seem to have disappeared over the years.
 

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An S-K Flowmeter tool is OK for multiple carburetors whose fuel adjustments happen when YOU make them.
The ECU is constantly making pre-programed fuel adjustments on an FI bike.

Using a homemade $4 mulletometer is as good as it gets for matching PRIMARY throttle plate openings (vacuum)
between 2 throttle bodies, IMO. Just as important is first measuring to be sure the SECONDARY (upper) plates
are synched. The ECU uses the secondary plates to fine tune air/fuel and mostly eliminates FI surging if idle is
set to specification, i.e. 1200-1300 rpm; and if TPS is set to raise the -C00 bar around 1700 rpm.

All these adjustments were done on purchase of my K2 in 2008, each made a real difference in comfort and
performance, and haven't needed re-adjusting in 32K miles.

Good idea to have a new PITA-to-replace air filter on hand, while everything is open. Be sure to save and
re-use the air filter sealing gasket-ring.

Since feedback to the ECU comes before the mufflers, it won't make a difference if the LV cans are on for the STP,
TBS and TPS adjustments. Yosh/Teka or Power Commander changes to the ECU map would need to be re-done
after adding them.
 

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Stock bike with the LeoV pipes works on my '06. No PC/yosh. An occasional hiccup but nothing to write home about...
 

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Perform the "chudder" test and this will tell you what's causing the vibes. If the engine is smooth performing the chudder test, then get ahold of realshelby and get one of his "werks" baskets. This will make your Vee smoother than a Wee!
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I have a new air filter the PO gave me when I bought the bike. I should have mentioned there are only 7K miles on it. But I might as well replace the filter while its apart.

I've watched the video but am a little unsure about some of the steps, particularly the steps for getting the dealer readout thing. I'll watch the video again and keep my laptop handy while I'm doing the procedures.

Thanks for all the information so far.
 

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Using a homemade $4 mulletometer is as good as it gets for matching PRIMARY throttle plate openings (vacuum)
between 2 throttle bodies, IMO. Just as important is first measuring to be sure the SECONDARY (upper) plates
are synched. The ECU uses the secondary plates to fine tune air/fuel and mostly eliminates FI surging if idle is
set to specification, i.e. 1200-1300 rpm; and if TPS is set to raise the -C00 bar around 1700 rpm.
Made big and red to emphasize this. I did TBS/TPS two times before adjusting the secondaries, and never noticed much of an improvement. My secondaries were out quite a bit and once I had them dialed in, and did a TBS, WOW what a smooth bike!

Do this first, trust me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I appreciate the advice. And I do prefer to do it right the first time. I'm just the kind of learner that does better when I see it done once before attempting it myself versus just reading and following directions. Thankfully there's a lot of good information on this and the other websites.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I still haven't gotten to the throttle body stuff yet. I've spent the last few days installing Symtec heated grips, new front and rear Battle Wings (that rear is a stiff tire and took some creativity to get mounted. I also installed the LV exhausts. I'm going back and forth with the rear silencers in and out. I don't like a lot of noise but like the deeper tone.

I have a Power Commander 3 scheduled to arrive in the mail today or tomorrow.

Here is what I understand I should be doing before my trip on Thursday.

easy stuff - oil change/chain lube

1 - Check and adjust secondaries
2 - Install the new air filter while its open
3- Put the extended lines on the throttle body nipples so they are easier to reach in the future.
4 - Check adjust TPS then TBS.
5- check all the fittings

6 - Finally, install PC3 after everything else is within spec
Did I miss anything or get it out of order?

I have some leftover antifreeze from closing the swimming pool. I'm planning on using that for the homemade meter. Assuming colored fluids are created equal?
 

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I'm working out the kinks on a fairly new to me 06 1K Vee. I'm sinking a significant amount of money into it with farkles and stuff. So far I've added the new Givi Trekker 3 piece cases, an Easter Beaver fuse block, a Baldwin Saddles seat and a few other things. It is getting there but the engine is annoyingly un-smooth.

In the upcoming October 2011 issue of Motorcycle Consumer News there will be a review of the Trekkers and Adventure MotoStuff mount I wrote along with pictures of my DL.

I also have a set of Leo Vince cans on the way. I've got a set of Battle Wings in the garage waiting for my new Ingersol Rand compressor to arrive. I have the HF tire changer and change my own tires.

Here are my current questions. I haven't checked the TPS or the done a TBS yet. I'm assuming I should wait until I install the Leo Vinces. I'll need to build the $4 sync tool. I had a mercury one and got rid of it when I bought a SK tool for syncing the carbs on my ST1100. If anyone is familiar with the SK tool is it possible to use that to sync the throttle bodies on the DL? I haven't had the air cleaner off and don't know what it looks like under there.

So my questions is... Once the exhaust are installed which should come first the checking the TPS or TBS? I've done all the work on my other bikes but this is the first fuel injected bike so I'm hesitant to start pulling hoses and turning adjustment screws until I'm clear about what I'm doing. I do have a service manual.

If I knew of a dealership in south central New Jersey I could trust to have competent techs I'd be tempted to take it to them. But I haven't had any that come highly recommended and I read too many stories about the bike coming out of the dealer worse than it went in.

Thanks in advance for any advice.
No advice here, I just wanted to say "Good review". I think it was fair and balanced. Just read it this morning in my latest MCN.
 

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From the O.P. "Once the exhaust are installed which should come first the checking the TPS or TBS? I've done all the work on my other bikes but this is the first fuel injected bike so I'm hesitant to start pulling hoses and turning adjustment screws until I'm clear about what I'm doing. I do have a service manual."

You never mentioned remapping the fuel injection. Although the TPS and TBS are critical to smooth performance, nothing you can do with them will affect the lean problem you will encounter with a set of Leo Vince exhausts. Your TPS and TBS can be perfect, but without enriching the mixture, the bike will run poorly with the new exhaust. The only ways to remap the FI that I know of are the Power Commander, Yosh Box, or a few other controllers that interface with the Suzuki ECM.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Doug - thank you for the kind words. I haven't even seen the article yet. I usually get my copy delivered about a week after I see posts about the articles I've written.

I do have a Power Commander being delivered today or tomorrow. I just finished an oil and filter change and have my laptop in garage Googling how to get the tank off... my Haynes manual is proving slightly useful. The forums do better.
 

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Power Commander map info:
Power Commander Maps

(It is well worth the minor cost to be paying subscribers of both these forums. Each is a gold mine of good info, but from different avenues and some different folks.)
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Power Commander map info:
Power Commander Maps

(It is well worth the minor cost to be paying subscribers of both these forums. Each is a gold mine of good info, but from different avenues and some different folks.)
I'm now a paid member. And appreciate all the assistance I'm receiving while getting this bike dialed in.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I thought I'd circle back and post a follow up. I did the TPS and installed the extended hoses to prep for the TBS, and installed a new air cleaner while it was open. I wish I had some iridium plugs on hand I would have done that too.

The PC III arrived but I had some trouble getting the plugs apart to install it so I took it as an omen to not make any big changes before a long trip. I left 2 days later and rode 2,300 miles south from NJ to Virginia, MD, WV, NC, TN, SC and GA. Rode to Deals Gap again. The 3500 rpm hesitation was annoying the entire trip. I did find I really like the riding position. And the new Battle Wings seemed to do whatever was necessary for the riding situation.

When I got home I installed the PC III and built a home made sync tool using the clear hose and 2 stroke oil. I installed the Jett map. I'm running the Leo Vinces with the rear baffles out for the time being. But I have the stoke air filter. I cold locate a map that fit my set up exactly but I'm pleased to report its running much much better than before. The 3500 coughing is gone.

I have had people behind me tell me that when I crack open the throttle hard they smell raw gas so maybe this isn't the right map for my setup.

Thanks for the advice, I'm sure I'll be back for more.
 

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I would say a small extra gas when you crack the throttle may be a good thing. PC#3 maybe getting ahead of the computer controlled throttle plates

I am here so you think about tre

My understanding is

1,2,3 gears are retarded 4 is full power 5th has like a rev limiter and 6th has its own lean highway cruise map <<< maybe urban legend

Regardless a tre will give you 4th gear full power all the time as God and tire manufactureres intended

I made my own from VSRI but can be bought

Your mileage will vary down to 38-40

I also took off the intake muffler weird honking (fun) little smoother

Mine is wheelie quick but is really only smooth from 3800 to 4300 RPMs
 
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