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Is upgrading the brake calipers and master cylinder worth it?

12K views 23 replies 13 participants last post by  RLBranson 
#1 ·
After riding a buddies KTM 1090, the brakes on my Wee seem lacking. The brembo brakes were amazing on the KTM, and got me thinking if my next project should be a full upgrade of the brakes. I did expect the brembo brakes to be superior, I just didn't expect there to be such a noticeable difference.

For the Strommers that have done the full/ partial upgrade to master cylinder, 4-pot calipers, and braided SS lines, did you find that the upgrade was worth it? Or maybe if the master cylinder upgrade alone would provide enough benefit.

I should add that I have already swapped out the front pads with the EBC double-sintered pads.

Thanks in advance for the insight
 
#2 ·
No need for the master cylinder. No need for the braided stainless lines. But both would make incremental improvement.

I installed the 4 piston calipers on my 2012 DL 650. It now has decent brakes. Before doing this it was "pull the front brake lever damn near to the grip for maximum effort stopping"!

Buying the 4 piston calipers and brackets is worth ALL the money and effort. It is that much of an improvement.

I had HH pads on the stock calipers.

There are some who have done this conversion and were less than completely satisfied. I will tell you that I think they never got all the air out of the system. That isn't easy. Too me a few days to get it right.
 
#6 ·
Keep in mind the old saying "no mater how much you polish a turd in the end its still a turd".
??? very well said.

I dont expect to match the KTM braking prowess, but now that I know the brakes are underperforming getting up to par has become my next project.


For those that dont want to upgrade your brakes, keep away from expensive bikes with really good braking systems ?
 
#7 ·
Realshelby, thanks for your insight. Appreciate you sharing

I am pondering an experiment. Adding the calipers, taking some braking distance measures. Then adding the master cylinder, taking some additional braking distant measures. It wont be scientific enough for the an article in the Journal of Medicine, but would be entertaining to read while sipping a beer.
 
#8 ·
A master cylinder is matched to the caliper/s. Adding a larger M/C will make the brakes feel wooden and will take more effort to stop. Add to small of a M/C and other problems arise.

As for getting air of the system, reverse bleeding is the only way to go. My Guzzi T3 with linked brakes has broken mortals trying to bleed them. When I totally rebuilt the braking brake system I was worried after hearing all the horror stories. Pints and pints of brake fluid, vacuum bleeders and hours of time. Well in 20 minutes using the reverse bleed method I had the entire system bled and all tools and put away.
 
#9 ·
Richland Rick at adventuretech.biz was going to make the caliper brackets available. I would check with him first.

Changing the master cylinder is more complicated than it seems. Giving up your factory mirror mount for instance. Then there is the sizing. While it seems the 4 piston caliper would NEED a bigger displacement master cylinder, that isn't necessarily true. The stock calipers have much larger pistons, so the amount of fluid needed to apply pressure isn't all that different. The 4 piston calipers work better in part due to EVEN pressures across the pads as well as a bit more force. Again, bleeding the system after installing 4 piston calipers seems to be where you are either happy or not so much. Reverse bleeding is something I would certainly try next time. I went through two quart bottles of fluid getting mine right! I think the problem is getting air out at the master cylinder hose junction.

Stainless steel hoses would probably help even more. I am happy enough with mine as they are. Two fingers on the lever and you can give the front tire all it can handle. Stainless braided hoses would increase feel and response I believe.
 
#10 ·
I guess I'm spoiled by never having had good brakes on all the Beemers I've had. The brakes on my 04 Wee seem fine. They seem a bit better with stock pads and a fluid change.
I guess like horsepower, if you've never had it you don't miss it.
Maybe I under ride my sight line and don't need panic stopping power?
 
#12 ·
Good brakes are not just on high end bikes. That is why I bitch about the V stroms having less than average brakes ( except for the gen 2 DL 1000 ). You can make light of it, but really good brakes are a difference maker when in a dangerous situation. Sight line or not, there are dangers that appear no matter where your sight line is!
 
#11 ·
I did caliper swaps on both my Stroms and definitely support that change.
Just did the brake line swap on my buddies 1000 after adding risers and while improved he still wants calipers after riding mine.
On top of the better braking it just has a better feel when braking.
I will eventually upgrade the lines down the road!
Mike
 
#14 ·
ebay seems to be about the best all around source for calipers. If you can, find a set off a newer bike. That way there is less chance of needing a rebuild. Rebuild parts, at least OEM parts, are VERY expensive for these!
 
#21 ·
Well, you may never have practiced emergency braking. Or maybe you never owned a 70's CB 500 Four honda or a CX 500 Honda. Neither of which would actually lock the front wheel on concrete when practicing stopping. The KZ 900 I owned was the first bike I owned that would do that easily. The 82 900F Honda I had was the first one that I could brake at maximum effort with two fingers. None of the V stroms I have owned had very good brakes in stock form. Yes, they will stop you. But the difference between that and what other bikes offer in significant.
 
#22 ·
I have an '05 Vee. Braided lines, GSXR calipers. It is an improvement, not impressive though. The strom has been the only bike that I use the rear on the street too. Two up with luggage is mandatory duel braking. We do not poke around.

I did not do the MC upgrade, but would like it. I don't really want to lock the front on dirt, but would like the option of a quick bite. The upgraded brakes are still slow when you compare to other bikes.

Both my dr650 and ktm 250 give me that option. I'm talking a panic stop on dirt were you alternate locking the front and rear. Two fingers on the lever, and a split second pull. The strom front is waay too slow for that. By the time you get the front to bite that hard, you have completely nose dived and the suspension is a mess. I also have very stout fork springs.

I use to ride a cbr 600 on dirt. It had very potent brakes. Yet, you could very quickly modulate them with just a finger grab.

Okay, I've convinced my self, I need a different bike. LOL
 
#23 ·
I have rebuilt cbr600 nissin calipers and master cylinder. SS brake lines. Cost was about 500 if I remember. Quick two finger braking stops me scary fast. I upgraded because I always ride with two fingers on the brake and three on the grip puppies. The grip puppies take the stress off my wrists but make the throttle supper sensitive. The two fingers on the brake help me control both well. I noted the calipers won't fit if you have spokes.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 
#24 ·
I ride a 2005 wee and also a 650 suzi scooter. the scooter has much,much better brakes than my wee. there have been times riding double when a cager did something stupid and the the very good brakes of the burgman 650 saved the day. my wee's front brakes are weak for solo riding in an emergency. I will not be carrying my wife until I get better front brakes on my wee. they are okay for non emergency use all day, but not good for emergency use riding solo. packing double they are even worse in emergency use.
 
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