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IMO, it is not the ultimate number that is the most important. It is more on how it is delivered. My CBR1100XX is almost electric motor like in its delivery. From about 3,000 to 10,000 rpm it is virtually linear in its acceleration. And dead smooth!
You need to pay attention at about 7K as there is quite a kick due to the increase in torque.
Honda claimed 165 at the crank which translated to about 140 rwhp. I have ridden bikes with more outright hp but none that were better in the delivery.
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Discussion Starter · #42 ·
This will be interesting.
I fully agree with your thinking, to an extent.
Even off road I sometimes wish my 650 had more grunt, sometimes.......
Seems I started an interesting discussion. What amazes me is the number of comments that align hp. and torque for rapid passing of slow traffic. My sixes cb250 could overtake most things and all that was required was wise use of the gearbox. Many comments spoke of achieving this by merely rolling on the throttle which is the case with my gsx 1250 but this is in my opinion a reflexion of the bulk of cars being automatics that reduce the driver inputs as in manuals. A motorcycle should be a whole experience rather than it being like a car. Also I was amazed how many American rider spoke about interstate cruising at up to 90MPH. My research shows the speed range in the states to be 55-80 mph so can only assume that law enforcement there for speeding is quite poor as so many ignore the limits.
My riding style also use engine braking a lot with its advantage of having controlled declaration into corners and having the right gear with the best torque range to accelerate out of it. The Vstrom excels at this yet the gsx1250 could stay in top gear and just use the throttle due to its flat torque curve, boring.
 

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Coming off my TL1000S 1997 and to a KLV1000 2004, i miss the torque.. I would love to have stuck the TLS engine in the KLV..
Exiting corners on the TLS on a twisty road is has been one of the most fun i ever had on a bike..
 

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Mmmmm Blackbird
Tho I like the red

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Did that 7k bump come via VTEC??

Was that the predecessor to the Fireblade?

My CBF1000 was a peek into that world with easier ergos and no insane HP....just lovely smooth torque from low rpms.
 
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Mmmmm Blackbird
Tho I like the red


Did that 7k bump come via VTEC??

Was that the predecessor to the Fireblade?

My CBF1000 was a peek into that world with easier ergos and no insane HP....just lovely smooth torque from low rpms.
The BB does not have VTEC. The bump came (just a guess) because everything just "came together" at that rpm. eg. fuel management, valve timing, exhaust design, etc.

I don't think the BB lead to the Fireblade. For example, the BB engine had balance shafts to make it so smooth. I don't think the fireblade engine has those. Also, the BB was designed to be a high speed tourer (analogous to the Ferrari 575 Maranello and 612 Scaglietti's of the time); capable of going long distances, in a short time,without crippling the rider.Whereas the new Fireblade is more sportbike (analogous to the Ferrari 458). With that being said, I have not ridden a Fireblade. I have sat on one and did not like the riding position compared to my BB.

I will say that if anyone has not ridden a liter superbike, you should. It is really hard to describe.

BTW - it is a BLACKbird not a REDbird:)
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The BB does not have VTEC. The bump came (just a guess) because everything just "came together" at that rpm. eg. fuel management, valve timing, exhaust design, etc.

I don't think the BB lead to the Fireblade. For example, the BB engine had balance shafts to make it so smooth. I don't think the fireblade engine has those. Also, the BB was designed to be a high speed tourer (analogous to the Ferrari 575 Maranello and 612 Scaglietti's of the time); capable of going long distances, in a short time,without crippling the rider.Whereas the new Fireblade is more sportbike (analogous to the Ferrari 458). With that being said, I have not ridden a Fireblade. I have sat on one and did not like the riding position compared to my BB.

I will say that if anyone has not ridden a liter superbike, you should. It is really hard to describe.

BTW - it is a BLACKbird not a REDbird:)
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I currently have a 954 fireblade. Yes the BB was purpose built for what it does. Fireblade is near race bike. 400lbs, 150+ HP. reduced flywheel inertia. Creates tunnel vision at will. I will readily concede it has more spunk than I can manage, but Oi it is fun.:D I also have an SV100s. 120 HP. More in line with what I can manage. Does not compress time, my brain and reflexes can cope with it. To be so lucky.
 

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I was amazed how many American rider spoke about interstate cruising at up to 90MPH. My research shows the speed range in the states to be 55-80 mph so can only assume that law enforcement there for speeding is quite poor as so many ignore the limits.
Most interstates in the US are in the 65-75 mph range for speed limits, and the generally accepted cultural practice here is that up to 10 mph over the limit is acceptable on the highway (~5 mph over in the city) if you're just cruising and won't attract undue attention from the law. That said, if you're the only guy doing 10 over the limit you will stick out and be more of a target, particularly if you're weaving in and out passing other motorists.

Ironically 90% of the guys doing 15+ mph over the limit are cops... off-duty or otherwise.
 

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USA speed limits.
I have found that 4 MPH over costs the police more money to issue a ticket and time they make on revenue. 9 MPH over could be worth a ticket.....but ten over then suddenly becomes worth it.
While cruzing over here my friends and I do 4 MPH over on the "blue" roads and 9 MPH over on highways and interstates. Of course you need to watch traffic is it not safe.........
In town and city riding obey the rules. We also have the advantage of space over here. There are places in the US where there might one police officer for 400 square miles. On the other hand there are stretches' of popular roads where every 5 curves another police officer is sitting, or between cities.
So yes I do think we drive a little faster here.
 

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Ironically 90% of the guys doing 15+ mph over the limit are cops... off-duty or otherwise.
My friend who is a motor cop said they are trained that way so as not to be stuck in the same spot for too long.
 

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I think if you are going with the flow of traffic on an Interstate highway, that's acceptable.

Where I live, you are most likely to receive a speeding ticket on the various US designated highways that run through the rural and touristy areas of the state. Most often by State Troopers. They are out, especially on weekends, looking for that driver or rider who is pushing it or passing a bit too aggressively.
 

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"Too much" is any more than you can safely control.
 

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"Too much" is any more than you can safely control.
Is there anyone who doesn't believe that they can control their vehicle at the speed they are going? Everyone is a very good driver.....in their own mind.
To paraphrase George Carlin......everyone who is slower is a moron and everyone who is faster is an idiot.
 

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Um yeah. ✋
Admitted a Porche 911 Turbo was involved but headshake at the speed a 911T can reach is not fun.

I'd waved him past and for the fun of it tried to keep up on a DL1000. FWIW. Probably had a higher top speed than me but my brakes were far far better and I hauled him in on corner entry. (Don't do it is the best advice I have, I blame that near lethal lapse of judgement on Cabin fever)
 

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Discussion Starter · #54 ·
Most interstates in the US are in the 65-75 mph range for speed limits, and the generally accepted cultural practice here is that up to 10 mph over the limit is acceptable on the highway (~5 mph over in the city) if you're just cruising and won't attract undue attention from the law. That said, if you're the only guy doing 10 over the limit you will stick out and be more of a target, particularly if you're weaving in and out passing other motorists.

Ironically 90% of the guys doing 15+ mph over the limit are cops... off-duty or otherwise.
If any of you guys come to Australia you will find that on interstates 99% of the riders drivers are no more than at the limit or 5 Km over. This is a lot due to us having one of the lowest road death tolls in the world. We were like the rest but 30 years ago aggressively dealt with the problem with speed and one of the first in the world to mandate seat belts. For a country that started as a English convict colony we have improved somewhat since then.
 

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It's all in the wrist, the right one. I had a 2012 Kawasaki Ninja 1000 ABS a few years back, 125 RWHP made it the most powerful bike I'd owned. I never felt it was too much power, I used what I needed/wanted and had a reserve if needed. My newest ride is the 2019 Kawasaki W800 Cafe, 46 RWHP, and I have a blast riding it on same backroads as I did on the Ninja. Nowhere near as much pull/push as the Ninja, but it still puts a huge smile on my face as I ride it on a curvy road.
 

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The 72 HP of my '17 650 XA would seem to be plenty, but if you add a passenger, luggage, and ride at altitudes over 5k ft on steep grades, 1000cc/100+ hp is barely enough. If I'm riding the Rocky mountains in Colorado, the FJR is more fun.
 

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The distinction is between "want" versus "need". Any 'ole bike will travel the back roads, but depending on the performance expectation level, you may "want" more ponies. I am slow in the straights, but the lean is "where it's at" so I corner hard. I have a DL650 and I make it sweat hard on the back roads. More often than not I will pin the throttle coming out of corners. My FJ-09 (115HP) is a lot more responsive and has more of that torque across the gear range that I am looking for and will slingshot me out of a corner the way that I want. It also has that additional power to catapult past someone in a short passing zone.
 

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Um yeah. ✋
Admitted a Porche 911 Turbo was involved but headshake at the speed a 911T can reach is not fun.

I'd waved him past and for the fun of it tried to keep up on a DL1000. FWIW. Probably had a higher top speed than me but my brakes were far far better and I hauled him in on corner entry. (Don't do it is the best advice I have, I blame that near lethal lapse of judgement on Cabin fever)
If the 911 Turbo was from the early 2000's or later and working properly there is no way a bike can outbrake the 911. If you did seem to outbrake it I suspect the driver just wasn't using them fully.

..Tom
 

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If any of you guys come to Australia you will find that on interstates 99% of the riders drivers are no more than at the limit or 5 Km over. This is a lot due to us having one of the lowest road death tolls in the world.
I live in Southern California, although I've driven across state lines to Arizona, Nevada, Utah. It seems the speeding habits of drivers are quite similar in this region of the USA.

If I were to generalize these habits, freeways usually 75-85 on average. Interstates (big highways outside population centers) are about the same. The fastest posted speed limits in Southern California is 70 mph. In Arizona I saw 75 mph posted. So, we break the speed limits....A LOT. If I were to summarize the experience of riding a motorcycle, the one thing I've learned is NEVER to sit in the slow lanes doing 75 unless everyone else is doing the same or slower. If I sat there at 75 mph, I would have a number of irritating morons passing me left and right, cutting in front of me! Forget about doing 75 mph in the fast lanes. It would be worse.

Outside of these freeways and interstates, and outside of population centers, which is to say the backroads, the speeds are much slower. So for example if I were cruising along on famous Route 66 in the California desert, I wouldn't be going faster than 65 mph.
 

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I can offer a new rider's perspective. After 6 months commuting with a 300 cc bike I bought the V Strom 1050. I commute on the expressway and I tour 2 up with luggage. I have never felt under-powered in traffic or over powered on the 100 hp 1050. I can putter along at 70 miles per hour and still jet into a safer lane position at any time. I can also use the throttle and engine braking to perfectly control my position relative to other traffic on slow roads. The only thing I miss about the 300 is the gas mileage, but the 1050 is worth it because its fun.
 
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