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Discussion Starter #1
2013 650A with 19,000 miles. I can see no wear on sprockets and can't pull chain away from rear sprocket. My concern is some links are stiff when cold. They can be straightened easily by hand and are not as stiff after riding. The chain stretch test is at the limit at several runs of chain.

This may be the original chain-there is no master link.

Should I be concerned?
 

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It's probably not "bad", but at the limit of the spec makes it fair game for replacement.
Personally, I go for the pull away from the rear sprocket test over the 21 pin/ 319mm, (or whatever it is), as I find that a difficult measurement to do accurately, but if you are confident in your measurement it's better to replace than have a problem.
I recommend denniskirk.com for a matched set, either RK or DID. Fair prices, good customer support.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
It's probably not "bad", but at the limit of the spec makes it fair game for replacement.
Personally, I go for the pull away from the rear sprocket test over the 21 pin/ 319mm, (or whatever it is), as I find that a difficult measurement to do accurately, but if you are confident in your measurement it's better to replace than have a problem.
I recommend denniskirk.com for a matched set, either RK or DID. Fair prices, good customer support.
I'm not real confident on stretch measurement. It is hard to keep tape centered on first pin while reading scale on second pin. Since the chain doesn't pull away from sprocket, I think it is probably good. What about stiff links?
 

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If you can move them by hand they are not frozen. A good cleaning with kerosene may loosen them up more. Make sure the o rings are undamaged.
 

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Don't clean the chain! (With kerosene or anything else)

Get some transmission fluid and put a drop on where the plates touch each other. That should loosen up the links. Then use some good oil-based lube and carefully lube each link. (I like Wurth HHS2000 as my lube.) Once you have this chain working fine you lube it with every fill-up and after every ride in the rain. (This will take about 10 to 20 seconds if you have a centerstand ) Don't clean it, people's advice to do so is just repeating what others have said on the web.

I now have my chains comfortably lasting 50, 000 miles / 80,000 km.

..Tom
 

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The O rings look good, but a small amount of grease is being flung out.
If the “small amount of grease” being slung out looks like tiny black spider webbing, get a chain and sprockets set on order. If you are a daily rider, by the time it gets here you will want to replace it.

BTW when I gently cleaned my chain with kerosene and a tooth brush, several of my o rings (or x-rings or whatever) failed a few weeks later. My chain already had over 20k and I was asking questions like you are.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Don't clean the chain! (With kerosene or anything else)

Get some transmission fluid and put a drop on where the plates touch each other. That should loosen up the links. Then use some good oil-based lube and carefully lube each link. (I like Wurth HHS2000 as my lube.) Once you have this chain working fine you lube it with every fill-up and after every ride in the rain. (This will take about 10 to 20 seconds if you have a centerstand ) Don't clean it, people's advice to do so is just repeating what others have said on the web.

I now have my chains comfortably lasting 50, 000 miles / 80,000 km.

..Tom
I looked at the Wurth site and the closest thing they list is HHS-K hinge lubricant. Is this an update to HHS2000?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Don't clean the chain! (With kerosene or anything else)

Get some transmission fluid and put a drop on where the plates touch each other. That should loosen up the links. Then use some good oil-based lube and carefully lube each link. (I like Wurth HHS2000 as my lube.) Once you have this chain working fine you lube it with every fill-up and after every ride in the rain. (This will take about 10 to 20 seconds if you have a centerstand ) Don't clean it, people's advice to do so is just repeating what others have said on the web.

I now have my chains comfortably lasting 50, 000 miles / 80,000 km.

..Tom
I looked at the Wurth site and the closest thing they list is HHS-K hinge lubricant. Is this an update to HHS2000?
 

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I looked at the Wurth site and the closest thing they list is HHS-K hinge lubricant. Is this an update to HHS2000?
Yes it was re-labled in the USA but same stuff.

..Tom
 

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Your 50K mile chain life is like double what others consider good. I have WD40 in the gallon can that I used to clean the chain with a grunge brush.
A well oiled chain with the right lube won't need cleaning per se, perhaps a wipe down?
Oh, getting a good sprocket set and a quality chain helps with chain life. Look to the Vendors here on the forum first.

When I changed the front sprocket for a 16 tooth it was solid steel and I haven't noticed a change in noise or operation, it did drop the cruising rpm 500.
 

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Don't clean the chain! (With kerosene or anything else)

Get some transmission fluid and put a drop on where the plates touch each other. That should loosen up the links. Then use some good oil-based lube and carefully lube each link. (I like Wurth HHS2000 as my lube.) Once you have this chain working fine you lube it with every fill-up and after every ride in the rain. (This will take about 10 to 20 seconds if you have a center stand) Don't clean it, people's advice to do so is just repeating what others have said on the web.

I now have my chains comfortably lasting 50, 000 miles / 80,000 km.

..Tom
Very good advice!!!!!!!!!!!!! I second V-Tom's recommendations. Follow them to the letter and you too will have a chain that lasts that long.

My Experience: I cleaned a chain with kerosene years ago on a different bike. The chain failed very quickly after that "cleaning". I DON'T USE ANY SOLVENTS TO CLEAN MY CHAIN. The chain on the ZRX1200 had over 36,000 miles when I sold it. It was still going strong.
 

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don't wait for the chain to get kinky. keep it lubed with ATF to keep the O rings from becoming stiff and cracked.

It is not the kerosene or WD40 that kills the chain when cleaning it but the brushing that damages the O ring seal . Don't brush O rings, especially in a dirty environment.
 

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Your 50K mile chain life is like double what others consider good. I have WD40 in the gallon can that I used to clean the chain with a grunge brush.
A well oiled chain with the right lube won't need cleaning per se, perhaps a wipe down?
Oh, getting a good sprocket set and a quality chain helps with chain life. Look to the Vendors here on the forum first.
...
I literally never clean my chain, never wipe it down and don't see any reason to. Any dirt on it is superficial. I suppose there would be little harm in gently wiping off the chain (as long as dirt isn't getting pushed into the O-Ring area) but I can't see any reason to do so and I don't do it.

I don't know if it is available in the USA but in Canada there is a factory kit that provides an OEM chain and OEM front and rear sprockets. It is a decent deal and I have been using it. My front sprockets are replaced before the chain and rear so I get a generic steel front sprocket for the in-between change. If it wasn't available I would just get a quality chain set like DID.

..Tom
 

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ANY SOLVENT can and will remove the lubricant behind the O Rings. The chain will then fail. Brushing the chain only speeds that process.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I ordered Wurth HH-K lube and sprayed it on and found it to be clean and odorless. I then noticed that the can was labeled HHS plus. I called the distributor and was told that the HHS plus was the latest version of HHS-K.

We shall see how it works.
 

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ANY SOLVENT can and will remove the lubricant behind the O Rings. The chain will then fail. Brushing the chain only speeds that process.
Shouldn't the o-rings prevent the solvent from getting inside the link? Within reason, of course - some solvents are very thin and "wicking". But pretty much every spray chain lube is carried in a volatile solvent, even the o-ring safe ones.

ps This is not a problem I have with my R1200RT :wink2:
 

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O rings in good condition form a tight seal to keep mild solvent out and the internal lube inside. mild solvent is used to flush automatic transmissions so you know that mild solvent is not is not harming the many O rings and neoprene seals in the expensive auto transmission. Mild solvent or kerosene should not be applied to an O ring chain with a stiff brush. you should use only a very soft brush or dauber to apply mild solvent or kerosene to clean an O ring chain and it is not needed very often or not at all if the chain does not get very very dirty.

ATF will keep the O rings pliable so that they can do their job of sealing dirt out and lubricant inside the chain.
 

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Your 50K mile chain life is like double what others consider good. I have WD40 in the gallon can that I used to clean the chain with a grunge brush.
A well oiled chain with the right lube won't need cleaning per se, perhaps a wipe down?
Oh, getting a good sprocket set and a quality chain helps with chain life. Look to the Vendors here on the forum first.

When I changed the front sprocket for a 16 tooth it was solid steel and I haven't noticed a change in noise or operation, it did drop the cruising rpm 500.
Here is how my chain looks right now:



This is typically how my chain looks and where it lives. Literally never "cleaned" or even wiped down. I am on some unpaved roads though the course of the week so the sand and dirt is normal. It was lubed last night on the way home so would have about 100 km/ 60 miles on the lube. It will be lubed again tomorrow night as I wil lfill up the tank again.

This is the third chain on my DL1000. The bike has a bit over 191,900 km / 119,250 miles. The chain has about 28,500 km / 17,750 miles so should be good for about 52,000+ km / 32,000+ miles before I replace it.


..Tom
 
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