StromTrooper banner

1 - 20 of 29 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
252 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Looking for street tires that provide excellent handling and braking while complementing the look of the DL650, hence considering these 2. No plans for anything off road with possible exception of short stints on dry hardpack. Both are of recent developement, thus use the latest tire technology and design. Reading reports that describe somewhat shorter life span for the Avon rear tire compared to comparable street tires, possibly due to softer rubber in center of rear tire.
While neither is a bad choice, wonder if folks have experience with both and appreciate a comparison. Is one superior to the other in function or durablility?
Thanks in advance,
Mark
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
185 Posts
Looking to replace my Heidenau K60 scouts with these, can't complain about the wear rate but after a couple of little slippy incidents and a now inherent distrust of these tyres I've been looking at the Trail riders.
My ABS seems to activate far earlier than I would expect as well.
Have you seen this review ?Earth-Roamers : Avon TrailRider review after 25,000 km
I doubt wear will be a problem for you if it wasn't for these guys.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
151 Posts
I purchased avon trailrider in February for this season but i didn't mounted them yet. My understanding of the review is that they will last long if you ride gently, but might melt if pushed hard.

Envoyé de mon LG-K210 en utilisant Tapatalk
 
  • Like
Reactions: SECoda

·
Registered
Joined
·
502 Posts
I like the Avon AV54 r / AV53 f. The front is still in really good shape at 6500 miles but the back isn't.

I have 1 millimeter (1/32") or a fraction more down the middle. I keep the rear at 40-41 psi. Right now, the rear is close to not passing Pennsylvania's annual vehicle safety inspection (requires 2/32" tread depth down the middle) depending on which garage I would use.

The rear could probably remain street legal up to 10,000 miles if 50% of the time was spent riding on gravel / dirt at less than 40 mph like the Earth Roamers.

Sept 2016, I ran some interstate at 70-80-90 mph up in Vermont / New Hampshire / Maine and when I would stop, I could smell burning rubber and the tire was hot but at approx 45 psi when I would check. It was just me and about 30 lbs of gear. I did run some dirt like the whole Bayley-Hazen almost to Canadian border and the tires did OK.

Great tire but not as hard down the middle as I would have liked (you can see center band of rubber versus the edge).
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
252 Posts
Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
I like the Avon AV54 r / AV53 f. The front is still in really good shape at 6500 miles but the back isn't.

I have 1 millimeter (1/32") or a fraction more down the middle. I keep the rear at 40-41 psi. Right now, the rear is close to not passing Pennsylvania's annual vehicle safety inspection (requires 2/32" tread depth down the middle) depending on which garage I would use.

The rear could probably remain street legal up to 10,000 miles if 50% of the time was spent riding on gravel / dirt at less than 40 mph like the Earth Roamers.

Sept 2016, I ran some interstate at 70-80-90 mph up in Vermont / New Hampshire / Maine and when I would stop, I could smell burning rubber and the tire was hot but at approx 45 psi when I would check. It was just me and about 30 lbs of gear. I did run some dirt like the whole Bayley-Hazen almost to Canadian border and the tires did OK.

Great tire but not as hard down the middle as I would have liked (you can see center band of rubber versus the edge).
This is the wear concern I have, mentioned by other folks on other forums as well.
Wondering if the wear characteristics of the Scorpion Trail II are similar, but have not found a head to head comparison.
Both seem excellent 90/10 tires, trying to find out if one is superior, or if they are very close in performance and wear, in which case the choice becomes more difficult.
Would not be surprised if wear is comparable, as I suspect there is no free lunch; good handling and grippiness comes with the price of shorter lifespan.
Thanks for the feedback!
Mark
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
502 Posts
Made the switch at 6868 miles from Avon TrailRider to Avon TrekRider only on rear. Also went to a 48-tooth sprocket to add a little low end. "Seasoned" the new rear tire yesterday with 100-miler to slowly narrow the "chicken strips". No dirt yet.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,412 Posts
I have never ridden on the Scorpion Trail II so I can't speak to those tires. I do have a set of the TrailRiders on my V2. I ride them at 35lbs cold both F&R. I ride solo , mainly back roads and rarely gently.
Currently they have about 4500 miles and look fine. I expect, like all my tires, they will last to that 6800 mark that Spike cited.

They warm up fast, by design. We got rained on pretty hard a couple of weeks back just as it got dark. Because there had been no rain for a while I turned the traction control to max but never flickered the TC light. I don't exclusively use Avon tires but have been using them back to '74 (Avon Venoms). They are always a viable choice and I find that they stay round right to the end. The TrailRiders were 3 years in development and at first I was sad to see the Distanza line ended. (bought one last pair for my SV650) But these are just fine and a bit better on the road insomuch that they are now 90/10 and they wrap around the edge a little further. I prefer the 90/10 over sport/trackday tires because around here the roads are never swept between heats. We have those mini, mini land slides which leave gravel between the car tracks for days and lot's of road-snakes.

Last, I have seen the occasional mention of melting. They won't melt. But after a vigorous session if you get down and closely sniff them (no photos please) you can smell the rubber. Gota love the smell of hot rubber.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,531 Posts
I am following two local guys with the Trail Riders to see how long they go and the longest just broke 11,000 miles on his rear tire. He rides mainly pavement at varying speeds and shorter trips like I do. The second guy just broke 9000 miles on the rear and has plenty of mileage left.

I would be curious as to what you guys get with K60s. My buddy switched from K60s to the Trail Riders after about 12,000 miles on the K60s. It appears he will pass that on the Trail Riders or at least match it.

What we hear is the heat from very fast long highway rides will kill them (or most tires). We just don't do much of that here. There are huge disparities being reported on the Trail Riders based on riding habits and temperature it seems.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
502 Posts
On my 3300 mile trip, I ran the TrailRider rear at 40-41 psi (cold) since I was carrying sidecases with +/- 35# of gear plus a drybag on the tail rack. I also had a tank bag and then drybags of tools on the "ears" of the crash bar. Altogether, including me, it had to be close to like riding with two-up and they recommend 41 psi on the rear. Around town I carry the tankbag and my rainsuit is on the tail rack.

I liked the Avon TrailRider tire as long as it lasted (some off-road but rather be on the KLR with Shinko 700 / 244 tires) but I often smelled burning rubber after any sort of continuous long distances.

You can see how the base layer of rubber (dark shapes down the middle) start to come through. The cords would have been next.

I had to run the bike through PA state vehicle safety inspection and the tire wouldn't have passed +1/32" tread depth (confirmed when new tire was installed by same garage I went back to the following day and successfully completed the inspection).

10000 miles could be possible with a lighter rider than me, less gear than I tend to carry, shorter runs resulting in less heat, and more dirt (~30 mph) than what I did.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,437 Posts
Looking for street tires
OK
No plans for anything off road with possible exception of short stints on dry hardpack
OK
Is one superior to the other in function or durablility?
Hmmmm

The owner of Avon, Cooper Tire & Rubber Co. of Findlay, Ohio, gives a 15,000 mile tread life warranty for the Avon Storm 3D X-M street tires. China National Chemical Corporation (commonly called ChemChina), owner of Pirelli & Metzeler, is a Chinese state-owned chemical company, offers no tread life warranty for their tires.

Avon Motorcycle Tyres North America » Storm 3D X-M

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,398 Posts
Innnnnnnnteresting. I did not know the new Avon Storms were out and available in Strom sizes.

Reasonably priced, too -- $274.76 a set right now at RMATV/Jake Wilson.

If you're not planning on dirt, these look like a strong choice.


I'm one of the people who have had very poor tread life with the Avon TrailRider. Great performance, but they sure weren't long for this world. Still, Avon makes fantastic tires in general, so I haven't sworn them off or anything.


However, Avon's 15,000 mile "warranty" for the Storm is a complete joke -- you're required to have the tires installed and replaced at a dealer, and the dealer is required to fill out and send in the forms. Then you're required to ship the tire back to Avon (they'll reimburse "reasonable" freight costs). Then, IF they agree that ze papers are correct and the tire is indeed worn out before its time, they'll send you a gift card for a PRO-RATED amount of the tire purchase price, NOT including mounting, balancing, etc.

Any sort of warranty for motorcycle tires is a step in the right direction, but it's a ridiculous and unworkable rigmarole, and there's no accommodation at all for those of us who install their own tires. And it's hard to imagine a scenario where the reimbursement would be very worthwhile, since you're on the hook for all labor costs.
http://www.avonmoto.com/warranty/mileage-warranty







OK

OK

Hmmmm

The owner of Avon, Cooper Tire & Rubber Co. of Findlay, Ohio, gives a 15,000 mile tread life warranty for the Avon Storm 3D X-M street tires. China National Chemical Corporation (commonly called ChemChina), owner of Pirelli & Metzeler, is a Chinese state-owned chemical company, offers no tread life warranty for their tires.

Avon Motorcycle Tyres North America » Storm 3D X-M

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,531 Posts
I looked at them too but then I wondered if they blow out with high speeds and heat on highways as well?

They use the same composite silica tread compounds as the TrailRiders. Maybe they need that warranty like a Yugo did. lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
502 Posts
I had the opportunity to "cut" out a section of my worn Avon AV54 (rear) that had 6868 miles on it when I switched to the Avon AV85 TrekRider.

I know it is crude but it does show that there was steel even in the sidewalls although it is hard to see. You can also see how thin it was getting in the middle. Maybe I should have run lower air pressure than +/- 40 psi.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,412 Posts
I looked at them too but then I wondered if they blow out with high speeds and heat on highways as well?

They use the same composite silica tread compounds as the TrailRiders. Maybe they need that warranty like a Yugo did. lol
Curious. What would make you wonder about a blow out ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
256 Posts
I just got a set of Avon Trailriders mounted (not mounted in the pictures). I really had high hopes for the Shinko 705s. I was very happy with the Shinkos, but I had anticipated doing more dirt riding and that never came about and don't think it will so I went back to a less aggressive tread with the Avons (I say less aggressive as the Avon lugs are not as tall as the Shinkos). The front has 10K miles and I think the rear had at least 5K miles on it. Both had lots of miles left, but sadly the front was so cupped and howled so bad at 50 MPH I couldn't stand it any more.



 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,531 Posts
I'll be interested to hear how these do.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,412 Posts
TrailRider Update

Just thought I'd update my May '17 post to say that I now have about 6900 miles on these tires. Three nights ago (Wed) I went riding and had declared it the last ride for my rear tire. When I looked out at it the next morning the rear was flat. It looked ok (small O) at the start but at the end of about 160 miles it had chunked down the center here and there. As I said these tires have been used almost exclusively on back country paved roads / solo, no luggage / in a hurry. The front tire has no cupping or really any visible signs of wear. According to the Avon spec sheet The revolutions per mile are Front: 793 Rear: 823. So 30 more rev/mi on the rear.

I have just spent some time today (Sat) reexamining the tire horizon and decided to buy another TrailRider. The Scorp Trail II seems interesting but insomuch as the Avon has never given me slightest slip, twitch or wiggle, I'll stay with what I know.

I have never ridden on the Scorpion Trail II so I can't speak to those tires. I do have a set of the TrailRiders on my V2. I ride them at 35lbs cold both F&R. I ride solo , mainly back roads and rarely gently.
Currently they have about 4500 miles and look fine. I expect, like all my tires, they will last to that 6800 mark that Spike cited.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,531 Posts
Just curious as to what mileage you got on your 2014 1000 stock tires? My new leftover 2014 V2 has 6750 miles on it since being new last December and I think the rear should go another 3000 miles based on the indicators and amount of remaining tread (which is a lot IMO).

6900 miles doesn't sound so good to me but maybe your riding conditions, etc. wear tires a lot faster. I basically ride paved and a little gravel Ozark country roads as well. Some interstate to and from.
 
1 - 20 of 29 Posts
Top