Intiminator high speed compression mods - Stromtrooper Forum : Suzuki V-Strom Motorcycle Forums
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post #1 of 40 Old 08-25-2013, 09:37 AM Thread Starter
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Intiminator high speed compression mods

Updated see post #19

Made my first ride with the Intiminators on a rough two track this weekend, medium to large sized rocks. I was a little disappointed with how harsh the front suspension was. So it's time to mod. I wanted to pull them out to do the 1mm bypass mod for low speed compression on the street anyway (other than that I love them on the street). I'm going to do all the mods that Acerider has documented, any thing else I should try?
My setup now is
Stock Intiminators with stock springs. 5 wt. Amsoil fluid. Fork brace.
I'm a bit surprised at the amount of preload I need to set the sag at 40mm. I think I'm at 2 or 3 lines turned in on the adjusters.
My weight out of the shower is 145lb.
Rear Elka shock.


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Last edited by todd900ss; 09-10-2013 at 06:25 AM.
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post #2 of 40 Old 08-27-2013, 02:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by todd900ss View Post
Made my first ride with the Intiminators on a rough two track this weekend, medium to large sized rocks. I was a little disappointed with how harsh the front suspension was. So it's time to mod. I wanted to pull them out to do the 1mm bypass mod for low speed compression on the street anyway (other than that I love them on the street). I'm going to do all the mods that Acerider has documented, any thing else I should try?
My setup now is
Stock Intiminators with stock springs. 5 wt. Amsoil fluid. Fork brace.
I'm a bit surprised at the amount of preload I need to set the sag at 40mm. I think I'm at 2 or 3 lines turned in on the adjusters.
My weight out of the shower is 145lb.
Rear Elka shock.


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O.K. 2012 DL 650, I had a 2006 with professionally set up emulators.

2102 on relatively smooth sealed roads with Intiminators and STOCK springs felt a little harsher, but a lot better over bumps and irregularities.

Off road, mine felt good from the get go, the same faint harshness as on seal, but it basically got no worse even on pot holes and badly rutted sections. I went faster - no difference. I could even brake acceptably well on gravel corrugated surfaces which the K6 with emulators would never do. (The K6 would go corrugations them just fine, but braking at the same time, noooo).

Check everything else first. All the AceRider mod does is fix the slightly harsh on smooth seal thing and I suspect trades off some of the ability to soak up the big ones.

First, check that the Intiminators are actually sitting flat at the bottom. Needs a good torch and a better eye, but rotating the springs should seat them.

Oil:
Suspension Fluid - Pvdwiki

Not all 5Wt oils are the same viscosity. Castrol 5W/Motul 5W seem a bit thick to me, but after a couple of weeks - get beat up enough that it smooths out .

Also, make sure the front isn't binding, which is a possibility , particularly if you fitted a fork brace.

Loosen the LOWER tripple clamp bolts and the front axle pinch bolt, bounce the front end a few times, as far as you can. Retighten.

Check the oil level, with the front fully extended springs (but not spacers or washers) in, oil level should at least 170 mm from the top of the fork leg, ( and probably nearer 190mm).

150mm for the max. travel + 15mm for the space the top cap takes up + air gap left at full compression, probably needs at least 20-25mm air gap. Too high an oil level it will also feel very harsh.

Preload increased with the Intiminators - they take up 15mm at the bottom of the springs, back it right off, wind one in side until you feel it take pressure then one turn in, then set the other the same (There won't be the same definite 'pressure' change on the second one.

You can fix the preload adjuster range by making new (shorter) spaces with PVC pipe. I'm 90kg's and at ~40mm with that sort of adjustment. But for a start, get it feeling right.

That does seem like a lot of preload for your weight. Did you unweight the suspension completely before measuring the baseline ?. (Front wheel off the ground)

Finally after checking everything, ride the bike a couple of 1000k's before you play further, mine smoothed out a lot after a couple of weeks use. A combination of oil thinning and things bedding in I suspect.

Pete
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post #3 of 40 Old 08-27-2013, 08:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteW View Post
O.K. 2012 DL 650, I had a 2006 with professionally set up emulators.

2102 on relatively smooth sealed roads with Intiminators and STOCK springs felt a little harsher, but a lot better over bumps and irregularities.

Off road, mine felt good from the get go, the same faint harshness as on seal, but it basically got no worse even on pot holes and badly rutted sections. I went faster - no difference. I could even brake acceptably well on gravel corrugated surfaces which the K6 with emulators would never do. (The K6 would go corrugations them just fine, but braking at the same time, noooo).

Check everything else first. All the AceRider mod does is fix the slightly harsh on smooth seal thing and I suspect trades off some of the ability to soak up the big ones.

First, check that the Intiminators are actually sitting flat at the bottom. Needs a good torch and a better eye, but rotating the springs should seat them.

Oil:
Suspension Fluid - Pvdwiki

Not all 5Wt oils are the same viscosity. Castrol 5W/Motul 5W seem a bit thick to me, but after a couple of weeks - get beat up enough that it smooths out .

Also, make sure the front isn't binding, which is a possibility , particularly if you fitted a fork brace.

Loosen the LOWER tripple clamp bolts and the front axle pinch bolt, bounce the front end a few times, as far as you can. Retighten.

Check the oil level, with the front fully extended springs (but not spacers or washers) in, oil level should at least 170 mm from the top of the fork leg, ( and probably nearer 190mm).

150mm for the max. travel + 15mm for the space the top cap takes up + air gap left at full compression, probably needs at least 20-25mm air gap. Too high an oil level it will also feel very harsh.

Preload increased with the Intiminators - they take up 15mm at the bottom of the springs, back it right off, wind one in side until you feel it take pressure then one turn in, then set the other the same (There won't be the same definite 'pressure' change on the second one.

You can fix the preload adjuster range by making new (shorter) spaces with PVC pipe. I'm 90kg's and at ~40mm with that sort of adjustment. But for a start, get it feeling right.

That does seem like a lot of preload for your weight. Did you unweight the suspension completely before measuring the baseline ?. (Front wheel off the ground)

Finally after checking everything, ride the bike a couple of 1000k's before you play further, mine smoothed out a lot after a couple of weeks use. A combination of oil thinning and things bedding in I suspect.

Pete

Oil level is set with springs out and forks compressed...

EZ-RDR55
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post #4 of 40 Old 08-27-2013, 10:07 AM
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Todd, you might be able to find a local machine shop (or a hobbyist with a lathe) to drill a #60 hole down the axis of the Intiminator spindle. That is very close to 1 mm, and the size drill bit they may have in their drill index. Drilling that by hand or even in a drill press would be tricky. If you try, get a couple of #60 bits--they're really easy to break. And if it breaks and sticks in the Intiminator body, you're done. Start the hole with a #1 center drill before you start drilling with the #60 bit. Aluminum swarf (chips) stick to the drill bit, so use either oil or even silicone spray on the bit, and frequently back it out to clear the swarf.

A long 4-finger pick up tool makes it easy to pull the Intiminator out of the fork tube so you can fiddle with it. A thin stainless washer under the top nut of the Intiminator gives a better catch for the pick up tool and makes it even easier.

Experiment with different shim combinations in the Intiminator. Even try reducing the shims a lot, feel the result, then adding shims back in until you get the feel you like. Be sure the sealing ring around the edge of the Intiminator isn't too tight in the bore of the fork tube. If it is causing drag you can trim the ends if the ring to get it to slide smoothly.

Center drill:


Pick up tool:

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post #5 of 40 Old 08-27-2013, 11:26 AM Thread Starter
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I set the oil level with the springs out. Can't find my notes and can't remember the height. What is the factory setting, or do they only give the amount (cc).

I thought Acerider said more high speed compliance was to be had with the mod to the four holes on the upper body. By increasing the size, I think he only did two of the four. I need to read it agin.


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post #6 of 40 Old 08-27-2013, 09:35 PM
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Stock intiminator with oblong orifices (high-velocity bleed holes) pictures here:


-------------
Ladder 106 (from ADVRIDER)'s enlargement mod on 2 of the oblong orifices and his comments:
<<<<<<<<<<< After testing the shim stack for the Transalp, a few have been sold and the results have been very positive. But some riders report that they'd like a softer high speed and medium speed action. After many trials with different shims (I actually got down to one .015 and one 0.10 at one point) I'm convinced that the shims do not do anything for high speed bleed and little for medium speed bleed.

To date, I've had the best improvement with modifying the holes under the inertia valve very similar to your mod.

I did something a bit different, however. Reasoning that if I wanted more bleed on medium speed impacts the inertia valve would have to have an effect EARLIER in it's travel. Coming from the world of 1970's MX I thought I could just raise the port (similar to lowering the exhaust port in a 2-strok) height of the valve and accomplish two things: (a) allow the inertia valve to open the holes earlier reacting to a smaller impact and (b) increase the overall size of the bleed holes to allow softer high speed damping.>>>>>>>>>>>>>



------------------

Note the extra washer inserted below to give something for the "claw tool"to grab.


--------------------------
The enlargement of oblong holes would give a bit more bleed on bigger hits. IMO and with benefit of hindsight, the additional benefit is only barely noticeable. ( high-velocity damping over bigger amplitude bumps)

the 1 mm axial bleed hole on the intiminator body first mentioned by RangerRon on advice from Ricor makes the biggest difference on small bumps and dips or what i called surface irregularities - the bike feels a lot smoother going over it rather than feeling all those small irregularities. Yes you do pay a penalty in having a bigger brake dive - but IMO, intiminator works every well there, a a little worse than designed is still very good. If want the feeling of almost zero brake dive, you might not want to do this mod.

The 1 mm axial hole is very hard to drill with hand drill - i broke 4 before i give up. you would really a proper drill press or lathe to do properly. I end up paying the local suspension guy $20 to do it and he broke 2 cheap bits do it. At the end - he used his lathe and starts with a bigger drill bit and only use the 1 mm to do the last 5mm depth.

If someone can find a suitably softer spring, you would be able to tune when the high-velocity bleed start to happen

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post #7 of 40 Old 08-27-2013, 09:48 PM Thread Starter
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I'm I reading this right? The enlargement of the oblong holes is barely noticeable in high speed hits.


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post #8 of 40 Old 08-27-2013, 10:57 PM
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Quote:
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I'm I reading this right? The enlargement of the oblong holes is barely noticeable in high speed hits.


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kind of - bump absorbing damping from hitter bigger bumps and/or at faster vehicle speed is increased marginally improved IMO. I always thought hi-velocity damping on intiminator wasnt too bad when encountering bigger size bump once you get shimms set up correctly

To me it was always the hi-velocity damping over the smaller stuff that was an issue or characteristic of intiminator when compared to similar set up emulator in PeterW's old bike. This is where the axial bleed hole makes the biggest difference. A lot smoother over those tiny bumps or surface irregularities which one frequently encounters. The low velocity damping penalty is minimal.

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post #9 of 40 Old 08-28-2013, 12:20 AM
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Ace, what do you think about trimming the overlapping edge on the aluminum collar over the inertia valve? That might allow oil flow sooner...the inertia valve would have less distance to go down before the ports were open. I know, we're getting into very fine details here.

"Older people who are reasonable, good-tempered, and gracious will bear aging well. Those who are mean-spirited and irritable will be unhappy at every period of their lives.

"Let each of use properly whatever strengths he has and strive to use them well. If he does this, he will never find himself lacking."

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post #10 of 40 Old 08-28-2013, 02:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ezrdr55 View Post
Oil level is set with springs out and forks compressed...
Oil level is specced with springs out and forks compressed yes, but it's a lot easier to measure with springs in and fully extended, well, it is if you have a centre stand. So do it once by the book, pop the spings in, let the front rise, measure it again.

Just pointing out, if you put in aftermarket springs, the coils very likely have a different coil diameter , which changes the air-space when fully compressed and that's the critical measurement. The springs in measurement will be closer to accurate .


Also, for the OP, what were you expecting ?.
You aren't going to get light dirt-bike like compliance, but you should feel it's a lot more stable, and no jarring in the wrists over bumps, and the brakes should work decently, even when it's lumpy. I expected (and got) a lot less jarring ride and the ability to brake and steer reliably off road but I do still have to slow down for the big ones. You aren't going to get Dakar like performance without more travel.

Pete

Last edited by PeteW; 08-28-2013 at 02:13 AM.
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