When counter steering is not enough - Stromtrooper Forum : Suzuki V-Strom Motorcycle Forums
Riding Proficiency Tips and suggestions for improving the rider's safety skills and riding techniques

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post #1 of 31 Old 06-09-2013, 06:38 PM Thread Starter
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When counter steering is not enough

We've all done it, gone into a curve to fast and ended up on the other side of the yellow line. Good thing there was no oncoming traffic. Here's a trick I learned riding my rode cycle (yes, the spandex kind).
You can TWIST(pull up in one side while pushing down in the other) the handle bars in the direction you want to go and it will give you additional turning power.
Don't believe me, practice it first on a straight away and you will see immediately what I'm talking about. This has carried me through many unfamiliar curves and I hope if you ever need it that it will do the same for you.
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post #2 of 31 Old 06-09-2013, 06:49 PM
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That isn't twisting the handlebars. It is countersteering. While you said pull up in one side while pushing down in the other, what you are actually doing is pulling the top grip back and pushing the bottom grip forward. That is countersteering and tightens the turn. You have to be turning the bars. No other movement is possible unless you bend the bars and that would not accomplish anything.

Pat- 2007 DL650A was ridden to all 48 contiguous states. I didn't quite make it to 17,000 miles on the 2012 DL650A.
Nicknames I use to lessen typing, Vee = 2002-2012 DL1000s. Vee2=2014-2016 DL1000s. Wee = 2004-2011 DL650s. Glee = 2012-2016 DL650s
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post #3 of 31 Old 06-09-2013, 07:18 PM Thread Starter
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Meant what I said, not pushing forward on one grip while pulling back in the other but literally pushing DOWN toward tank with one grip while PULLING up on the other, it should feel like your trying to twist the handlebars. I'm sure your correct in saying this IS what us technically referred to as counter steering, now I know- thanks
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post #4 of 31 Old 06-09-2013, 08:03 PM
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You just think that's what you're doing. Sit on the bike and do the action you are claiming on the bars and see which way they actually move. If you actually move your hands in the direction the bars can really move, you'll stop wasting energy and use a lighter grip.

Pat- 2007 DL650A was ridden to all 48 contiguous states. I didn't quite make it to 17,000 miles on the 2012 DL650A.
Nicknames I use to lessen typing, Vee = 2002-2012 DL1000s. Vee2=2014-2016 DL1000s. Wee = 2004-2011 DL650s. Glee = 2012-2016 DL650s
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post #5 of 31 Old 06-09-2013, 08:58 PM
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Actually bicycles countersteer too. Its just that with some of your upper body weight always resting on the bars you can easily countersteer by shifting that weight. But it's still only the "steering vector" of that weight shift that countersteers a bicycle. As GW says, no need to push down on a motorcycle. Just (counter)steer.

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post #6 of 31 Old 06-09-2013, 09:04 PM Thread Starter
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Talking

Then try it while moving.
I know your not actually twisting or bending the bars, it's simply a mental aid to do something that does not feel physically natural- that in a - oh my god - situation could mean the difference between keeping it between the lines or getting hit head on.
Even a old wolf can learn new tricks
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post #7 of 31 Old 06-09-2013, 09:57 PM
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all you need to know

push left go left

push right go right

do NOT try and hold the bars in any particular direction at speed

at regular speeds =you guide the bike with force (push on bar) , unlike a car where you can HOLD the wheel and all will be well
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post #8 of 31 Old 06-09-2013, 10:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheyne View Post
Even a old wolf can learn new tricks
I'm aware it's a mental device to make a complex movement seem natural. I much prefer push left go left and push right go right. I didn't know until your last post that you knew it was a mental aid. I like my mental aids to describe the movement better as up and down don't properly describe the actual action. I put it in the same category as "weighting pegs", another bad description that causes confusion. The title, "When countersteering is not enough" is also misleading as the action described actually is countersteering.

Practicing braking and countersteering until the proper movements are in "muscle memory" is what prevents "Oh My God" events. If you have to think, chances are it's too late.

I am an old wolf, just turned 68. I did a paper on countersteering during my MSF instructor course in 1978. I hope to learn something new every day though and most days I do.

Pat- 2007 DL650A was ridden to all 48 contiguous states. I didn't quite make it to 17,000 miles on the 2012 DL650A.
Nicknames I use to lessen typing, Vee = 2002-2012 DL1000s. Vee2=2014-2016 DL1000s. Wee = 2004-2011 DL650s. Glee = 2012-2016 DL650s
See https://www.stromtrooper.com/general-...nicknames.html

Please vote in the poll on what Strom(s) you have at https://www.stromtrooper.com/informat...-you-have.html
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post #9 of 31 Old 06-09-2013, 11:52 PM
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I believe there is a YouTube video about Keith Code's(?) "Twist of the Wrist" that visually demonstrates counter-steering that, when done properly (as in moving the handlebar in the direction it can only possibly move), it is done with very little effort - one finger is what was shown, if I recall correctly.


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post #10 of 31 Old 06-10-2013, 06:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greywolf View Post
I'm aware it's a mental device to make a complex movement seem natural. I much prefer push left go left and push right go right. I didn't know until your last post that you knew it was a mental aid. I like my mental aids to describe the movement better as up and down don't properly describe the actual action. I put it in the same category as "weighting pegs", another bad description that causes confusion. The title, "When countersteering is not enough" is also misleading as the action described actually is countersteering.

Practicing braking and countersteering until the proper movements are in "muscle memory" is what prevents "Oh My God" events. If you have to think, chances are it's too late.

I am an old wolf, just turned 68. I did a paper on countersteering during my MSF instructor course in 1978. I hope to learn something new every day though and most days I do.

Greywolf, do you remember when the4 first "MSF" course was developed? I had no idea it had been around that long. I had my first course in '78 provided by US NAVY. back then, they threw a 2x4 under your front wheel while riding

2012 DL650
U.S. NAVY, RETIRED
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