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General V-Strom Discussion Talk about all things V-Strom not limited to just one of the above models

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post #1 of 11 Old 08-03-2006, 11:06 PM Thread Starter
 
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ABS

Before you jump on the band wagon for ABS on your bike, has anyone thought about how do you do a brake slide, with ABS turned on.?? While ABS may bring the inexperienced near the ability of a professional stopping in a straight line what about needing to turn the bike while braking hard. A motorcycle does not turn like a car while under hard braking, you don't just turn the bars like a steering wheel, you need to lean the bike to get the quickest turning capability's. The ability to lock up the rear wheel and turn the bike has saved my back side from some things and has lessened the impact on others. Your thoughts??
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post #2 of 11 Old 08-03-2006, 11:41 PM
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That sounds a lot like the "lay the bike down" theory. Countersteering allows the best turning avoidance and braking to the limit of lock allows the shortest stopping distance. Braking in a turn pops the bike up and will high side it if held. Locking the rear wheel causes a longer braking distance and slower. less controlled steering. Brake or steer as appropriate. Combining the two isn't the best idea.

Edit. What does get mentioned is off road/gravel road situations. On a loose surface, ABS can mean no brakes. Riders want to be able to turn off ABS on loose surfaces.

Pat- 2007 DL650A was ridden to all 48 contiguous states. I didn't quite make it to 17,000 miles on the 2012 DL650A.
Nicknames I use to lessen typing, Vee = 2002-2012 DL1000s. Vee2=2014-2016 DL1000s. Wee = 2004-2011 DL650s. Glee = 2012-2016 DL650s
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post #3 of 11 Old 08-04-2006, 12:11 AM Thread Starter
 
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Have done it thousands of times and no you do not have to lay the bike down just down shift bring the butt around while pulling the clutch, rev it and throttle it hard release the clutch and you can and will change directions. P.S. Don't back off of the throttle or you WILL HIGH SIDE. Braking in a turn with both brakes does make the bike pop up or will make the front end slide out letting go of the front brake and sliding the rear tire will make the bike turn 90 degrees then throttle it hard. Anything you can do to prevent straight on impact will usually lessen injury. Applying both brakes very hard and sliding straight into what ever you are trying to miss hurts alot, sliding in sideways lessens the impact to your head and neck. This is assuming that you are not riding so far over your head that nothing is going to save your back side. 120 on a loaded mule you have no throttle left to get your butt out of trouble. I have gotten away with it at a 100 but never tried it at 120, badly scratched helmet and boots torn shoulder of my jacket, and torn knee of my riding pants. Small rasberry on my shoulder and a totaled motorcycle. Its a dirt thing that is useful on pavement, it just requires a lot more throttle.
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post #4 of 11 Old 08-04-2006, 02:00 AM
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Rule #1 for best control of a change in velocity on pavement, be it speed or direction, is to avoid slippage but barely. I was watching a TV program on road racers recently and a sensor system was used on race bikes during practice laps. Each wheel speed was recorded and printed out as a graph. Any place two colors diverged meant one wheel was moving faster than the other which meant one was slipping or lifting. One goal was to eliminate those divergences during practice.

Any slide diminishes control and has to be "saved" before making the next move. It also means a stop could have been faster or a turn could have been crisper. If you are sliding, your braking or turning could have been done better. Locking a rear brake in a maximum effort situation is a typical action and the result of less than optimal technique. The extreme example is laying the bike down. Sliding in sideways means you screwed up. It does not lessen the impact on the head and neck. That is a function initial impact speed and proper braking gets the impact speed lower.

Not getting to the point where a slide almost occurs also means maximum effort was not achieved. That's where ABS shines. It lets you get to the maximum with a minimum of slide, keeping the back end in line so maximum braking can be achieved and preventing the front end from washing out and doing an instant drop.

Pat- 2007 DL650A was ridden to all 48 contiguous states. I didn't quite make it to 17,000 miles on the 2012 DL650A.
Nicknames I use to lessen typing, Vee = 2002-2012 DL1000s. Vee2=2014-2016 DL1000s. Wee = 2004-2011 DL650s. Glee = 2012-2016 DL650s
See https://www.stromtrooper.com/general-...nicknames.html

Please vote in the poll on what Strom(s) you have at https://www.stromtrooper.com/informat...-you-have.html
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post #5 of 11 Old 08-04-2006, 06:11 PM
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Most riders will benifit from ABS on the road (not gravel,dirt etc ). Ask someone who has had it for a year or so and see if they would by a bike without it, have yet to find someone

Graham Downunder
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post #6 of 11 Old 08-04-2006, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by graham downunder
Most riders will benifit from ABS on the road (not gravel,dirt etc ). Ask someone who has had it for a year or so and see if they would by a bike without it, have yet to find someone
i didn't realize how much abs helped until i bought a bike without it. if the vee comes in abs at some point, i'll definitely upgrade. 95% of my miles are on the road and my dirt/gravel skills are not good/confident enough to slide the vee into a turn. having said that, i sure would like the ability to turn abs off, if needed. my gs adventure has this capability and when i'm on dirt i turn it off.
post #7 of 11 Old 08-04-2006, 10:46 PM
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I'll bet that even if there isn't a switch, a fuse can be pulled before riding unpaved surfaces.

Pat- 2007 DL650A was ridden to all 48 contiguous states. I didn't quite make it to 17,000 miles on the 2012 DL650A.
Nicknames I use to lessen typing, Vee = 2002-2012 DL1000s. Vee2=2014-2016 DL1000s. Wee = 2004-2011 DL650s. Glee = 2012-2016 DL650s
See https://www.stromtrooper.com/general-...nicknames.html

Please vote in the poll on what Strom(s) you have at https://www.stromtrooper.com/informat...-you-have.html
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post #8 of 11 Old 08-05-2006, 12:49 AM Thread Starter
 
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How many of those race bikes, or cars have ABS installed? not many if any. Even the Government no longer requires ABS on vehicles as it has not proven to be any safer then none ABS equipped vehicle.
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post #9 of 11 Old 08-05-2006, 02:50 AM
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ABS is not allowed in most forms of motor racing .Yes "some"drivers or riders can brake better on a RACE TRACK without ABS , but for most of us ride on the road without known brakeing points ,traffic both ways
,intersection, and the "other fool " doing stupid things at the most unexpected times. If you really want to know about ABS ask a race car driver if he wants his wife driving a car with or without ABS when she takes the kids to school.Insurance companies have lower premiuns for cars with ABS, Government departments generally specify ABS when they get cars.

It is good that you can have a choice, I would have it you can choose not to .

Graham Downunder
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post #10 of 11 Old 08-05-2006, 04:10 AM
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Ahhh I remember this topic on a BMW forum, people get quite excited about whether to ABS or not. I ordered my last beemer without ABS, not because I didn't want the ABS feature, I didn't want the ridiculous servo assist. So if the strom had ABS as std (Suzuki don't do the servo assist thingy) I would probably be happy to order it.
I agree, I'd want the ability to turn it off when on the dirt, however about 99.9% of the riders here would be able to stop quicker and safer with ABS on regular sealed roads where the grip varies. It's hard to practice threshold braking on the street.

I just don't know that I'd pay extra for it if it were an option.

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