Combustion Engine slow death - Stromtrooper Forum : Suzuki V-Strom Motorcycle Forums
General V-Strom Discussion Talk about all things V-Strom not limited to just one of the above models

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post #1 of 143 Old 10-20-2017, 12:02 PM Thread Starter
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Combustion Engine slow death

An article describing a few key dates when the combustion engine will be gone, at least over in Europe.

https://www.theweathernetwork.com/ne...e-facts/87493/
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post #2 of 143 Old 10-20-2017, 12:15 PM
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HUGE amounts of money are being spent on electric cars.


In my world (Porsche) Porsche AG is in the process of rebuilding and expanding their factory in Stuttgart for their new Electric car which will be on sale in 2020. (The prototype was called "Mission E".)

They are spending about One Billion Euros to do so!

Other brands are likewise doing similar things.

The world is changing!

..Tom
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post #3 of 143 Old 10-20-2017, 12:24 PM
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Ask the people on Puerto Rico their thoughts on electric cars. The electric car is just another infringement on privacy and liberty. Unpaid parking ticket? No charging for you. Just sayin.
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post #4 of 143 Old 10-20-2017, 01:04 PM
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Yet no company has shown a profit on electric cars.

I am all for them. Loved the hybrid I just sold and I think that technology is worth paying for. Would I buy an all electric car? Under the right circumstances. But, there is no way I can justify an electric car financially if you look at the real costs of ownership.

Yet!

But that may change........
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post #5 of 143 Old 10-20-2017, 02:10 PM
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EVs are an interesting idea. With the amount of miles driven and the number of vehicles in the states, I don’t see a complete replacement of the internal combustion engine working very well. The unintended consequences will be staggering. Battery disposal, excess demand on the output of the power grid, contamination from the large scale battery manufacturing plants. The number of charging stations and the time required for a charge will all be problematic.
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post #6 of 143 Old 10-20-2017, 03:20 PM
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Lithium batteries are 100% recyclable and repairable and good for 6-8 years to 80%

Charging is done mostly off hours and in fact there are programs already where owners can feed 40% of their battery power back into the grid during peak hours - it will be good for an aging grid.

Lithium battery plants are excessively clean tech. The impact is actually the fossil fuel used to deliver raw materials.
https://auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-...-batteries.htm

There are thousands of charging stations already in place and more every day

Quote:
Global Electric Vehicle Charging Station Market Analysis & Growth Forecast at 30.8% CAGR between 2017 and 2025
Press release from: Market Research Reports Search Engine
MRRSE
MRRSE The electric vehicle charging station market report provides analysis for the period 2015–2025, wherein the period from 2017 to 2025 is the forecast period and 2016 is the base year. The report covers all the major trends and technologies playing a key role in electric vehicle charging station market growth over the forecast period. It also highlights the drivers, restraints, and opportunities expected to influence market’s growth during the said period. The study provides a holistic perspective on the electric vehicle charging station market’s growth throughout the above mentioned forecast period in terms of revenue and volume (in US$ Mn and Thousand units), across different geographies, including Asia Pacific, South America, North America, Europe, and Middle East & Africa (MEA).
https://www.openpr.com/news/778418/G...-and-2025.html

High powered ones charge in 20 minutes to 80% and Tesla has both a 10 minute unit in development and an automated battery swap station patented.

But here is the key ...it's a draw

Quote:
The Cadillac Supercharger is one of 17 located at Meijers in six Midwest states, part of a network of 13 in Michigan. There are several more coming online soon, and three just across the border in Indiana and Ohio.

The stations are designed for road trippers rather than residents, who typically charge their vehicles at home.

“Normally I had to go to a gas station every single week,” Vogt said. “Now I only have to go somewhere besides my home when I’m going on a long trip.”

Meijer spokesperson Joe Hirschmugl said the charging stations are ideal for the retail setting.

"On average, our customers take about 45 minutes to shop," he said. "You can do a week's shopping here and drive away with a fully-charged car.
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Last edited by Macdoc; 10-20-2017 at 03:22 PM.
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post #7 of 143 Old 10-20-2017, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macdoc View Post
Lithium batteries are 100% recyclable and repairable and good for 6-8 years to 80%



Charging is done mostly off hours and in fact there are programs already where owners can feed 40% of their battery power back into the grid during peak hours - it will be good for an aging grid.



Lithium battery plants are excessively clean tech. The impact is actually the fossil fuel used to deliver raw materials.

https://auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-...-batteries.htm



There are thousands of charging stations already in place and more every day





https://www.openpr.com/news/778418/G...-and-2025.html



High powered ones charge in 20 minutes to 80% and Tesla has both a 10 minute unit in development and an automated battery swap station patented.


That is all great news and effective in our current numbers. I may be proved wrong but I foresee major problems when converting hundreds of millions of vehicles. 6-8 years is a drop in the bucket when discussing a replacement for fossil fuels. The things I mentioned are just a few concerns that come to my feeble mind. I’m sure there will be other unintended consequences that are as of now, not even considered. I’m not anti EV. I just suspect like many things that are proposed to be beneficial will end up creating their own source of problems.
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post #8 of 143 Old 10-20-2017, 03:34 PM
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2040 timeline seems to be way too optimistic. Development and production of the next generation of EV's is underway but no one is able to explain how these countries will address that massive spike in electricity consumption. I guess they need to build thousands of new power plants across Europe which alone can cost tens of billions. I could be wrong but in the future we might see restrictions and quotas in regards to travel and electric vehicle use ...

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post #9 of 143 Old 10-20-2017, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macdoc View Post

Lithium battery plants are excessively clean tech. The impact is actually the fossil fuel used to deliver raw materials.
https://auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-...-batteries.htm
Lithium mining ... one of the most energy consuming operations and not so environment friendly.
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post #10 of 143 Old 10-20-2017, 03:58 PM
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You ARE wrong - EVs do not require massive new sources of power. In fact they are a storage resource making existing power - notably making renewables far more efficient because they store additional power and let grids load level.

......

Ummm hundreds of millions of vehicles is an overstatement - it will work within the existing replacement cycle.
There is a tipping point where it makes no sense to continue to drive an ICE vehicle.

Copenhagen hurries that along with a 180% tax on new ICE vehicles. Other jurisdictions will move it along for various reasons.
In the US you are sheltered by very low fuel costs so the economics are not as compelling ....places like Norway the uptake on EV far outstripped gov expectations.

Tipping point comes around 25% of new car sales ....in Norway the program got EVs to 20% of new car sales in a heartbeat.

Each jurisdiction will be different and you can bet California will lead.

Hybrids will lead for a good while and distances on plug in hybrids on EV only are getting into the 40 mile range which is within most commuters range. So no range anxiety but little hydrocarbon fuel use.

One side effect is fuel providers need to react and add charging to their product mix but I suspect shopping areas will outdo them - using charging as a draw.

There will still be a long tail off for fossil vehicle fuels but for the heavy commuting regions that need clean vehicles ...they will force the issue

The Ford Bolt and the Tesla 3 both sell for average price of a similar ICE car and of course fuel costs are minimal, performance amazing.

We shall have to learn to be wary of EVs ...they shal eat us for lunch
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Ontario Canada rider staying in Cairns Australian Feb to May & Aug-Oct each year
Canada 2018 CB500x >2009 CBF1000 sold • 10 Wee ABS sold • 09 Burgman Exec sold • 10 NT700v sold
Australia> 04 KLR650 • 93 ST1100 sold •
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Last edited by Macdoc; 10-20-2017 at 04:01 PM.
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