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Stone Cold Bike

7K views 53 replies 13 participants last post by  BC Rider 
#1 ·
I rode my '05 Wee a couple of weeks ago and all was fine. Parked it in carport and walked away.

Yesterday, went to fire it up and it was dead. Stone cold dead. Nothing - no clicks, lights, nada. HoooBoy - put the charger on it and walked away.

Went out there just now, checked to be sure of fully charged battery and turned the ignition on. Nothing. Dead.

Checked all connections - tight, clean and solid. Fuses good. Looked into nacelle with flashlight and from just a quick look, all seems tight and solid. Red switch on handlebar is on.

Is there maybe a master fuse or something hidden away that I don't know about ?? Where should I start looking ??
 
#6 ·
In my 3rd sentence I mentioned that I checked battery voltage. Went out later and checked it again - 12.4 volts. Still completely dead. I've been busy with other things and haven't had time yet to sit down and work it thru. Figured someone here may have seen the same thing.

Picture taking the battery out of the bike and turning the key on. Dead, dead, dead.

The fuse by the starter relay sounds like a possibility. How do I find it ??
 
#7 ·
Depending on the type of battery 12.4 is between 50% & 75% SOC so too low and would indicate a bad battery if you have had it on charge.

You should put your meter on the battery then turn the ignition on and read the meter.

There is a very good chance your headlights are pulling your battery down to a point where it can't illuminate your dash lights.

When that happens the chances of the 30a fuse failing greatly increases.
 
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#9 ·
I had checked the fuse panel and all are good. Didn't know about the 30A one and it took some searching. You're right - the 30A was blown and I just happened to have a spare. When I plugged it in it sparked and snapped and blew, so I have a direct short in there somewhere. Getting late and I'm tired, so will go after it tomorrow. Thanks.

Something that surprises me is that the positive wire to the starter is hot with ignition off. I would expect it to be hot when start button is pushed. Switched negative seems unlikely on a starter that's mounted to the engine, tho' I know it's common in lighter duty circuits.

It surprised me in that the negative is fused, not the positive as I'd expect. Also surprised that "something" changed while it was sitting. When I rode it into carport the other week, it ran fine and all seemed well. Went to start it 2 weeks later and here I sit.

Suzuki engineers may have made the bike harder to work on, but I'm not sure how. Impossible to reach anything and tracing wires is a nightmare. The fairings ?? I run out of swear words when working on those miserable creations.
 
#12 · (Edited)
Did you remove the battery to charge it ?

Putting the battery in backwards will blow the 30a fuse and I know of no fuses on the negative circuit.

When you parked the bike could the key have been turned to far and the park lights been on ?
 
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#13 ·
You can try to narrow down what you need to look at. Remove all fuses. Ignition off. Put in 30A. If it blows its probably between the battery and the fuse box. The wire continues on to connect to the voltage reg and the ignition switch. Turn on the ignition. If that pops it look after the switch. If it doesn't blow start putting in the other fuses one at a time till it blows. In general though the 10A should blow before the 30A. And the 30A should be on the positive side.
 
#14 ·
Since you have power to the starter with the ignition off, the start relay contacts must be welded closed. This probably happened the last time you started the bike. If so, your starter would have been engaged while riding. If you have voltage to the starter and it is not trying to turn over, it may have been burnt up. The 30 amp fuse blowing is likely due to shorted internals of the start relay due to excessive current draw of the starter.
 
#15 ·
The 30 amp fuse blowing is likely due to shorted internals of the start relay due to excessive current draw of the starter.
I suspect Hilo Haole nailed it.

Also, the relay is in the positive leg of the starter wiring. It is possible to blow that 30 amp fuse while jump starting the bike incorrectly with a bad battery (based on personal experience).
 
#16 ·
Hokay, back to square 1. Last night I was tired and it was getting dark. I obviously boo-boo'ed a couple of times. So let's look at it with fresh eyes.

1st - no power to starter when sitting. Not sure what I "checked" last night, but no power there.
2nd - new 30A fuse blew instantly when I plugged it in. That gets expensive, not to mention finding fuses.
3rd - don't crucify me, but I built a pair of jumpers out of #10 wire and plugged them into the 30A fuse
sockets. Touch the ends together & they crackle and get hot very fast. Lots of current draw there. I only held them like that for a second or less.
4th - pulled all the other fuses and made sure ignition was off and key out. Still crackles and gets hot. 5th - Pulled the cap & wires off the top of the relay and it doesn't get hot. Those wires go directly into the wiring harness and I see no bare spots or melted insulation anywhere.

Please keep in mind that it did run fine when I parked it. I'd only run it from head of driveway where it was sitting with a For Sale sign down to parking area - maybe 200 ft, so no high rpm's - barely broke idle. Didn't notice any starter whine at that time and I'm pretty sensitive to such things.
 
#17 ·
Disconnect the battery and then disconnect the voltage regulator plug that has the red wire in it. Reconnect the starter relay plug you removed and then reconnect the battery. Does it get hot again at the relay or stay cold? The 30 amp fuse is connected to the VR and the ignition switch feed. Just trying to rule out a shorted VR.
 
#20 ·
No, the only aftermarket stuff I have on it - horn and power outlet/USB charging port - are wired and fused directly from the battery. I've triple checked for correctness. No shorts, no cross wiring.

That short has to be somewhere in the wiring harness under the tank or in the headlight fairing/ignition switch. Looked with a light but don't see anything obvious. As I said, no melted or bare spots.
 
#22 ·
Yes but if you turn the bars fully to the left & key fully to the left it turns the parking light on and you can still remove the key, you need to turn the key back to the right one click before you remove the key.

I don't know just how flat your battery was but a bad battery will self discharge to somewhere between 11.2 & 11.8 over that period, if it has gone lower than that it was a drain that caused the problem.

I'm more interested in weather you removed the battery because a battery installed backwards (& it happens a lot on bikes) will give your exact symptoms.
 
#23 ·
The VR is the voltage regulator. On the right front below the level of the tank. It is a finned box. I don't have the exact wiring diagram for your bike but as i see it the 30A connects to the VR and the VR connects to the negative battery terminal. As you have made up jumpers connect them to a 12 V bulb instead of each other and you have an indicator light. When hooked to the 30A fuse socket it will light up. Then disconnect the 4 wire connector from the VR. If the light goes out you have located your fault.
 
#24 · (Edited)
Are all the accessories grounded to the battery and not the frame?

How old is the battery?

When I was popping my main fuse the battery had gone bad. Changing the battery fixed the problem. But as I said above it happened during jumping the bike. Which still makes no sense to me.

Somehow I don't think that is your problem, but it seems worth mentioning. A four year old battery should at least be considered suspect.

Maybe someone else can tell us what the effect of a shorted cells.

The terms blown main fuse and battery provides a wealth of similar problems on other motorcycles.

A voltage regulator that has internally grounded will blow the main fuse.

This thread has some good advice. https://archaicarcane.com/dead-short-causes-main-fuse-to-blow/

And this thread about a V-Strom with similar problem. https://www.stromtrooper.com/v-strom-service-maintenance-questions-discussions/415637-no-power-blowing-30a-fuse-repeatedly.html

"greywolf post#2 from https://www.stromtrooper.com/dl650-d...main-fuel.html
"Try wiring a headlight bulb to the fuse terminals. When a short occurs, it will light the bulb instead of blowing the fuse. You can push the wiring around and see what area might be causing the problem. Hopefully, you can find a spot where pushing the harness around will cause the light to go on and of."
 
#25 ·
You guys nailed it.....I think. I pulled that &%(% airbox out of there just now to access the VR connectors. Unplugged both and no more sparking at the fuse. Re-connected the lower one with 3 large terminals and still OK. Connected the upper one with 4 small terminals and the short was back.

I'll order a new VR right away and let y'all know how it works out. No telling if something else is fried, but we'll give 'er a go. Many thanks to all who helped.
 
#26 ·
On a recent trip i had a similar issue while camping. The bike started but i had to crank it a few times to get it going. But you could hear the cold engine, and i dont particular like anything moving in the engine when its that cold, feels like its doing damage. You can see the bike running here, and it took forever to even get to 1 bar.
 
#27 ·
Back to square 1, I guess. I received the new VR yesterday and plugged it in a few minutes ago. (it came all the way from China in just 10 days) Then I plugged in my fuse jumpers and touched them together. There was a small, brief spark, then nothing. Turned the key on....nothing.

Is there a way to check the VR with an ohm meter ?? Can you guys think of anything that might blow that VR ??

Makes me a bit sick - $35 down the tubes. I did find cheaper on eBay, but couldn't see the connectors clearly on most. It did look like there were variations in connectors, so went till I found one that had similar connectors to mine and was listed as good for my '05. (some with different connectors were listed as good for an '05 as well)
 
#28 ·
Sure do hope someone has some ideas. I'm way over my head on this, but did some googling last night. Didn't understand most of what I read on how to check the regulator, but most gave advice on how to check it with engine running. My engine don't run. The whole bike is stone cold dead. Yesterday, the test light was bright so I knew I had voltage, but just now I put a meter on it to see just what I have. 12.2 volts. Low, I know, but should be enuf to light the instruments up and at least get a click out of start relay. The charger is on it now.

Nothing. I did try checking the terminals on the VR, but don't think it meant much. On the 3 terminal connector there was no continuity anywhere. On the small 4 terminal connector, blk/red to blk/red gave me 0.3 ohms and blk/wht to blk/wht gave me 0.3 ohms. Otherwise, nothing.

Plug in the VR, touch the fuse wires together - nothing. With the old regulator, they sparked hard. Just now went out and put the old one in and it does spark - shorted. New one doesn't do anything. Help.
 
#29 ·
Have you rechecked the 30a fuse ?

What happens when you short across the 2 terminals on the starter solenoid ?

I don't have a diagram for your bike but would think it would start without the R/R connected ?

If that is the case I would concentrate on getting things to turn over then revisit the R/R.

I would disconnect both headlights while doing this just to save battery power.

You need to load test the battery as it seams to drop voltage easily.

Are you 100% sure battery is not in backwards ?
 
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#31 · (Edited)
I've checked and rechecked battery polarity, but now having a problem with charger. I'll sort that out later. I shorted across the 2 large terminals beside the 30A fuse and the starter spins but doesn't engage.

I did notice that the test light is quite bright between battery terminals, but if I go from positive battery to engine as ground, the light is very dim. Reaching that bolt to clean the connection is going to be interesting - not sure it's possible.

So far, no worry about headlights - the entire bike is dead. Nothing lights up anywhere. Today I went ahead and put the airbox back on, fuses back in and started to put tank back on.....but can't find the 3 wire connector for the gas tank - for gas gauge and fuel pump, I 'spect. I've looked and looked and now tearing hair out - where do I look for that fool connector ?? Took air box back out, still no connector. Whoever designed that whole airbox mess should be shot.

With airbox back on and everything connected except for tank connector, still stone dead. Volts are down to 12.1, so will have to sort the charger in the morning.

While looking for it with flashlight, I noticed what looks like droplets of melted metal down under where the rear tank support goes. Where on earth would they come from ?? Here's a picture........
 

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#30 ·
So you still have no power to the rest of the bike? A shorted VR blows the 30 if it provides a path to ground. Disconnect the 4 wire plug to it. Put in the 30A fuse. On top of the fuse are two small bare spots. They connect to the metal of the fuse. Use a meter or a test lamp(one wire to a good ground)and check each side. Should be power on each side. The 30A feeds the fuel system fuse, then continues to the ignition switch. Check both sides of fuel fuse. Any power there? If you have power the next stop is the ignition switch.
 
#33 ·
Maybe the battery is the problem not the charger ?

If you have some jumper leads you can bypass the bikes earth and make a new connection from the battery to the motor and see if that helps.

A bad earth can cause many problems and as the voltage drops the amps increase.

Running jumper leads from a known to be good battery can be helpful, look for sparks from a short or a current draw as you make the last connection, do that connection at the motor somewhere.

It's been a long time since I pulled the tank from a Wee but I think the plug for the fuel pump was further towards the back than the air box, near the seat & tank joint on the right side.
 
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