"Thank President Clinton for the near gun ban on military posts in CONUS."

Maybe our current administration will examine the events, and change that, or not...

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Medford, Or.
30 miles north of Mexifornia
2007 DL1000 Black
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lots of stuff on both.

 

Well, you are of course entitled to your opinion. I am not a liberal, however. I also think it is a form of mental illness, perhaps even worse than the mental illness that passes for "conservatism" these days. I do not think the Obama dog and pony show is going to make things better, they will make things worse, far worse. Those who think that changing from Republican to Democrat, or vice versa, will bring about more than superficial changes, are deluded. They are just two wings of the same party. If you doubt that just consider what would happen to any politician, of either faction, if he even mentioned the possibility of real change on any of the really important issues. For example, how long do you think a congressman would last if he seriously suggested putting troops on the southern border and deporting all illegal aliens? Or if he tried to undo the damage caused by the so-called civil-rights movement or scrap forced integration? Or if he dared suggest that we should withdraw all support for Israel and demanded that they give up their nukes? He would be attacked by the various news media, be investigated for everything under the sun, and be hounded out of office. His own party, of whichever flavor, would lead the attack.

There will not be any meaningful change in this country until about 99% of the political whores running our country, from a local level up to the highest levels are hanging from gallows. The same goes for the news and entertainment media, we will once again have a free press in this country someday, but a hell of a lot of editors will have to be shot first. Democrat or Republican? When the guys with the ropes start making their rounds they really won't give a damn whether the treasonous bastids swung to the left or swung to the right, they will just simply swing them by their necks.

Y'all have a nice day now.

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Clinton was a gun-grabber of the first order, no doubt about that. But weapons have been tightly controlled on military posts for a long time. I was in the army back in the early '70s, most of my time was at Ft. Hood, and even then almost no one walked around with a weapon. When they did issue you a weapon for guard duty or something it was without ammo. Even out on the gunnery ranges they were careful to account for every weapon and every round of ammunition.

__________________
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Speedohealer

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Fixed it for you. Funny though that your own belief system doesn't fit the definition that you yourself posted, so now you are going to try to make the definition fit your beliefs instead.

It is not important for my beliefs to say that you have a belief. It is however important to an honest exchange of ideas that all parties acknowledge where they are coming from. Your refusal to admit that you believe that there is no God by claiming that non-belief is not a belief is ludicrous. The only person you have snowed with that nonsense line is yourself. I suppose you also believe that deciding not to vote in an election is not itself a decision.

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I believe that it is when we are most offended by other's, be it in their actions or words, an appropriate "unthreatening and humble" response is what is required of us. That is what sets "Christianity" and "Christians" apart from other religions. With the belief, is supposed to come the power or ability, to respond in a way that shows we can be different - maybe better than those who offend us. As for God, I don't think we need to make threats about taking action on His behalf. He did after all come up with the phrase, "Vengeance is Mine".[/quote]





Those that do, do not threaten....those that threaten, do not do....

Hankster, I'm with you, I am amazed at those who claim to know all, see all, and have the only opinions or beliefs that matter.

__________________
Gary

Oklahoma Somewhere

K9 650 Wee
04 KLR 650
03 DRZ 400
03 DR 200
01 GL 1800

When I am offended I will take action on my own behalf--its my faith being demeaned. Moc made a public apology, which took a certain amount of class, and it was appreciated.

Snowball, I don't know you and you sure as hell don't know me, but I respond poorly to people whose opening lines are meant to needle me.

I've got some opinions that I have earned by many hard trials, and when I air them I make it my business to treat others fairly and courteously until they become offensive. Am I the only one who feels this way? I doubt it.

I can state my case fairly well, can you? If you have a problem with me then spell it out if you can.

I was agreeing with Hankster and commenting on his post. If you choose to opt in feel free but I agree with what Hankster said. Nuff said.

EDIT ++++++ I should have read the off topic rules.....no politics, no religion posts. That pretty well sums it up. I will follow the rules.

__________________
Gary

Oklahoma Somewhere

K9 650 Wee
04 KLR 650
03 DRZ 400
03 DR 200
01 GL 1800

I would agree that Middle Eastern people are probably genetically predisposed to order their societies certain ways, including certain forms of government, just as Europeans are and Asians are. They have a long cultural history, they have been doing things their way for centuries or Millenia, and they tend to resent it when a alien culture such as us tries to impose our values on them.


In the case of Iraq, yes, they actually were doing rather well as compared to others in their region. Most of the world's countries ARE backward cesspools. In fact the people of most countries around the world, almost the entirety of Africa for example, are worse off right now than the Iraqis were under Saddam Hussein.


If their own intelligentsia don't believe they can be changed then what in hell are we doing wasting American lives and tax money trying to change them into us? Maybe they don't WANT to be us.

Change brought about by the Iraqis themselves at American gunpoint.

Of course we are forcing it on them. We invaded their country, blew up their cities, destroyed most of their infrastructure, removed their government, disrupted their foreign trade system, impoverished the people, and occupied their country. Peaceful transfer of power? That is like having the thug that sticks a gun in your face in some back alley and demands your wallet claim later that you gave it to him freely with absolutely no resistance at all.

I am sure some of them do dread us leaving. I am also sure that these are the same people who will end up being shot for the crime of collaborating with the enemy, once we leave. Now you and I both know all we did for them was for their own good, but as you said, they are some backward SOBs.

An Iraqi may freely speak his mind as long as it is not against the occupation government, but even then he won't be murdered. Arrested perhaps, and then executed for opposing democracy and freedom. But not murdered.

The thing about Islam that makes it so dangerous is the conviction Muslims hold that Islam is the truth and the light and unbelievers must be either converted or killed. I believe Ibn Warraq talks about this. They are 100% convinced that they are doing Allah's work and any opposition to their holy mission is unspeakably evil and worthy of death. Americans tend to hold this same attitude when crusading for THEIR holy mission to spread Demawkcrasee and Freeedom to the Downtrodden masses of this oppressed world.

Biggyfries, I don't mean any of this as a personal attack on you. I would hope you don't take it that way. I actually do find your ideas interesting, and I enjoy discussing these topics.

__________________
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When I went to Iraq I went with a lot of ideas I was raised with, and knew that being in Iraq was going to be an enlightening experience. I found it was a life-changing experience. I saw firsthand everything I wrote about in the above posts. I saw many times the phony 'news', fed to the public by the anti-American media.

I can't belive the hatred of America by many Americans. Fstreed you are a smart guy--you must know that we are not the insidious evil as you describe!

I have firsthand experience over there, I have firsthand experience in the observation of Iraq cities and people. I admit not being any kind of final authority on geopolitics, but when you're there and see it with your eyes firsthand, and you come away with some strong opinions.

So I come back home full of pertinent information/experiences thinking others would be interested in what I saw/experienced--and it was shocking to me how little anyone cared. The common response I got when found I just came back from Iraq: 'do you have a death wish?' That is ignorance pure and simple, so I wanted to explain what I was doing there, and it was as if I were speaking Greek. No one wanted to hear anything.

If you and I spoke, I could tell you in detail what I saw, but I'm convinced it would be meaningless to you, because you are so invested in your disgust/hate of the US that you would willfully ignore the facts. You are not alone, in fact you are in the majority.

Here is some truth: We never were in control of ANY Iraq oil, then or now. We only imported a percent or two of Iraq oil at our peak, and we paid prevailing world oil prices, as we always do. It has never been otherwise.

We don't control Iraq policies or elections at gunpoint or any other method. We had an interim controling authority briefly when Saddam was inop/hiding. Our interim 'governor' stepped down as soon as they elected the hapless Maliki. He was the worst guy they could have elected, but we respect him because he was duly elected.

We are not an occupying Army. We are training their military, and they want to duplicate our military EXACTLY because they see our guys as fair, temperate, and definitely NOT murderous. Our soldiers are treated like celebrities until some of them do some despicable things, which I saw firsthand, specifically, a group of black soldiers who were verbally sexually badgering an Iraqi woman who wore form-fitting pants, and the black guys were so disgusting in their talk and actions, I reported the incident, and severe action was taken. I was kinda unpopular for awhile. (so what's new?)

I am confident as soon as the Iraqis can control the terrorism in their own country, we will be outta there. I wish we would install/retain a huge military base like Subic Bay. I am confident there will be much mischief in the region in the future, and I am confident they will not be diplomatic; one thing is absolutely true, Arabs may be murerous and callous to the sanctity of human life, but they respect military power above all. Their clerics may hate westerners (USA) but they grudgingly respect that we could annihilate them in a minute, but choose not to.

Our effort there is noble (even virtuous), and there is no effort to harm them--in fact every Iraqi I ever saw would give his left nut to move to the USA and live in freedom. We are offering that to them, but they seem to still disbelieve it can ever happen for them even though they desperately want it. They are politically spineless, because the memories of Saddam and others before him are still fresh in their memories.

One more bit of truth: We are disrespected worldwide, and especially in the mideast for our apparent love of wickedness, specifically the RAP culture (in music and film), the US is the epicenter of porn of every kind, vulgarity in thought and speech (just watch cable tv which is broadcast worldwide) and we embrace every kind of vice on the planet. At least this is what it looks like to them until they actually visit America, and then they see most of us are fairly straight, clean, and hardworking. In short, they see our broadcast media and think that all Americans are muderous theives with no morality of any kind, because that is what they see onscreen. Nice going Hollywood/music business! And to be fair, the rest on the world is seeing our decline of morality. We don't stick to good moral values like we did in the last century. I'm speaking in generalities here of course, the USA has never been perfect, but we were always thought to be far better than most of the rest of the world in most things, and we were proud of it. We now embrace every kind of disgusting behavior, and it looks ugly on us as it does on any other culture.