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Euro Troopers! For our friends "across the pond"

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  #21  
Old 08-01-2012, 12:20 PM
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You ever get stopped on your boat in the US?

Life jackets, horn, fire extinguisher, bailing device.....about the same as bikes across the pond. Interesting info.
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  #22  
Old 08-01-2012, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by vilguy View Post
Well if they are expecting me to squeeze in some useless first aid kit and some pointless hi vis loser bib in my tailpack for no reason whatsoever they can get lost. The mrs shoves enough useless rubbish in it.

And hi vis's ... sorry darling but i wouldnt be seen dead in one ... (i'll wait for some clever schmuck to write some witty retort on that) First aid kits are only ever any use for someone who knows how to use one. 99% of the dopey idiots on the road wouldnt have a clue.

I look on riding a bike as if I crash it will either be A) a pathetically tiny off and i will go "ow you bugger" followed by getting straight back on to avoid anyone who might have seen me being a spak or B) I will be completely messed up and need somewhat more than a sticking plaster or that bad one.....C) brown bread.

Thankfully in 10 years of riding 30,000 a year. I havent had any of the above. Long may it be the case.

If i get stopped and they give me a fine. Big whoop.

Just my opinion and your welcome to judge as much as you like of course
Basic first aid and CPR is taught in schools here. Or at least where I'm from (Europe is after all made up of several different countries, with different laws and practices). So anyone who pulls up to the scene has something with which he/she can start treatment until the first responders arrive. In many cases surely it won't help worth a damn, but in some it might. In others it might save you having to go to the hospital, because you can patch yourself up and be on your way. The kit costs 10 euros to buy. I know how to use one, I learnt it both in school and during my conscription days.

The high-vis, well I consider your opinion just stupid (I could judge as much as I wanted you said ). If you're pulled over on the autobahn, with cars whizzing past you in anything from 150-220 km/h (legally in Germany, mind you - no speed limit), anything that makes you stand out and be seen is a good thing. I wear high-vis gear anyway if it's anything below 25 degrees, I hope to be seen while I'm on the bike as well. I could tell an anecdote where a truck driver at night almost took me out because he suddenly realised there was another truck driver on the shoulder changing a tyre - with hi-viz, he would have seen him from afar and instead of doing a last-second yank at the wheel to the outer lane where I was, forcing me to break hard, the situation could have progressed a lot safer.

I do agree that this should not have to be law though. I can figure out by myself that this stuff is good to have, I don't need to be told. But many apparently do..
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Givi crash bars; SWMotech centre stand; LeoVince Evo II slip-ons; Rich's fork brace, farkle dash, mirror extenders, gps dash, and wheel spacers, and (soon to be fitted) footpeg lowering; narcosis junkie's skid plate, highway pegs and (soon to be mounted) raising links.

Last edited by K0m4; 08-01-2012 at 12:50 PM.
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  #23  
Old 08-01-2012, 02:56 PM
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People who think they know how to apply first aid though can often do more damage than if they had done nothing at all. CPR being the major one of that of course. I have done many first aid training courses over the years and the number of scary people that would kill someone that still get the pass grade is terrifying.

Having said that i recently had to use my training when some dumb horse threw its rider off and trampled all over her right in front of me (urgh that was a horrible scream) ... couple of broken bones, ribs and a collapsed lung in -5 degrees on christmas day... what a great start to it! I guess training has its place, but i think that if people are not confident in what they are doing they should leave well alone.

The hi viz thing.. its a personal choice thing. Whats next, i have to wear black undies on monday, blue on a wednesday and i will be searched by the border guards to check?! Its all a crock of political mumbo jumbo rubbish.
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  #24  
Old 08-01-2012, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by vilguy View Post
People who think they know how to apply first aid though can often do more damage than if they had done nothing at all. CPR being the major one of that of course. I have done many first aid training courses over the years and the number of scary people that would kill someone that still get the pass grade is terrifying.

Having said that i recently had to use my training when some dumb horse threw its rider off and trampled all over her right in front of me (urgh that was a horrible scream) ... couple of broken bones, ribs and a collapsed lung in -5 degrees on christmas day... what a great start to it! I guess training has its place, but i think that if people are not confident in what they are doing they should leave well alone.

The hi viz thing.. its a personal choice thing. Whats next, i have to wear black undies on monday, blue on a wednesday and i will be searched by the border guards to check?! Its all a crock of political mumbo jumbo rubbish.
I don't know how the courses and methods differ in different places, but with basic cpr this is simply not true. Every instructor and every source I've ever had and read underscores this strongly: the consequences of wrongly applied cpr are not as dangerous as doing nothing, if heart and respiration has stopped. If you snap a rib, that is nowhere near as dangerous as oxygen not being distributed in the body. Recently I've also been told that they've figured out that one of the big no-go's when I first got the courses many years ago - applying it if the heart still ticks - is also not so bad, so if in doubt you should apply it anyway.

I do agree that it should not be law about the hi-viz, but I sure wouldn't want to be without it at dusk on the Autobahn shoulder... then my undies would go from blue to brown pretty quickly. On a Wedensday, that is.
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Ok, if for nothing else than to keep track of it myself:

Givi crash bars; SWMotech centre stand; LeoVince Evo II slip-ons; Rich's fork brace, farkle dash, mirror extenders, gps dash, and wheel spacers, and (soon to be fitted) footpeg lowering; narcosis junkie's skid plate, highway pegs and (soon to be mounted) raising links.
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  #25  
Old 11-14-2012, 07:30 AM
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I certainly wasn't expecting such a debate when I created this thread.

Just to give my opinion on what a few things others have been saying. I now live in Spain and am a little more familiar with rules for continental Europe.

For most of the countries reflective jackets only need to be worn when stopped on the road side. Its the same for anyone that has to get out of their car, truck, van. I stopped to change a tire on a friends car a few weeks ago, it was dark, raining and on the side of a 120kph motorway, believe me I was happy to put on the jacket on. In my opinion its not a bad law especially since the economic crises around here means a lot of roads / motorways are no longer fully lit (I'm assuming its to save money).

The only difference (as far as I know) is France where bikers also have to wear their hi-vis in bad weather. What exactly is classified as bad weather I don't know but I have driven in France in the rain without a jacked and had nothing said to me. At the end of the day, like what has already been said, its the law and you are meant to do it. If you don't then be prepared to pay the fine or whatever happens. For me I always carry my hi-vis with me and put it on if bad weather is making me uncomfortable. I have only put it on 2-3 times in the past 18 months but like to know its there for those fog filled mornings.

Regarding the first aid kit, I agree its not the most useful in the event of an accident. They are only small kits that contains the basics. That being said I have used the single use eye wash, plasters, tweezers and scissors (for cutting electrical tape and cable ties).

My reflective jacket, first aid kid, spare bulbs, fuses, etc. and the newly compulsory in France, 2 disposable breathalysers all fits in behind the stock tool kit under the saddle. I'm happy to carry it all.
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  #26  
Old 12-05-2012, 09:36 AM
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In Canada there are requirements under Transport Canada regulations for various safety equipment on boats depending on the size. Random stops are common where boaters must produce the required safety items. This is not the same as a vehicle search and I am sure this is what is required in parts of the world for motorcycles. IMO not a bad idea and should be extended to cars and trucks for certain safety equipment.
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  #27  
Old 12-17-2012, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuke View Post
In Canada there are requirements under Transport Canada regulations for various safety equipment on boats depending on the size. Random stops are common where boaters must produce the required safety items. This is not the same as a vehicle search and I am sure this is what is required in parts of the world for motorcycles. IMO not a bad idea and should be extended to cars and trucks for certain safety equipment.
I do not support a law giving police to stop and search vehicles arbitrarily,
and that is what I see in this law:

"Show me your required First Aid Kit" says the cop.
Then he hangs over your shoulder while you open the container containing it.

"What is in that case that IS IN PLAIN SIGHT?" is the next question,
and imagine the hassle you will get if you balk at opening that case.

Please do not expect such a law to be welcome where the
Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution is respected.
(That's the one banning illegal search and seizure.)

Here's a glimpse of that amendment :
Fourth Amendment | U.S. Constitution | LII / Legal Information Institute

No, I say, and NO and NEVER.
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  #28  
Old 03-13-2013, 11:23 AM
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Default Hi-Vis Vests in France

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark87 View Post
Police can & do stop motorists to check they have everything (never happened to me on the bike but quite a few time in the car). Far more common is that they ask to see them if they have stopped you for anything else.

As for the reflective jackets I think anything from expensive hi-vis motorcycle jackets to your standard 2 hi-vis vest you pick up in a garage will do as long as it meets the European standard (Goggle EN471). I hear that countries where this is compulsory they are very strict on it.
What is the latest word on the requirement for Hi-Vis Vests in France? I read in one fo the Forums that the requirement for them along with the personal breathalyser was recinded. I will be leaving on a trip from Frankfurt to Bosnia via France and Italy at the end of April.

Can anyone very that these 2 requires have been recinded or not?

Thanks
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  #29  
Old 07-07-2013, 06:13 AM
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Default Compulsory Equipment in Europe

I recently rode from Frankfurt to Sarajevo, Bosnia, via France, Italy, Slovenia and Croatia. The reflective jacket requirement for France as well as the requirement to carry your own breathalyzer equipment was repealed. Yes some places require the first aid kit and the spare bulbs, but since I was never stopped expect in Bosnia, which did not ask or check, I'm not sure how "strict" they are about having them or not.

In the last 2.5 years I've ridden in Germany, France, Switzerland, Slovakia, Croatia, Bosnia, The Netherlands, Austria, Hungry, Slovenia and Belgium. The only place I have been stopped is here in Bosnia, 3 times in one day in fact. I was taking a nice ride around southern Bosnia on Memorial Day. The first cop saw my German plates and just waved me on, the second was 2 cops that just wanted to look at the bike, the third actually asked for my papers, but all was in order and no problems. In fact he probably couldn't even read them since they are in German, but he did his due diligence.
Europe so far has indicated that both the police and the average driver gives much more consideration to people riding motorcycles than in the U.S.. When they see that you are trying to pass, most move to the right and give you extra room to pass. Especially here in Bosnia where 90+% of the roads are twisty mountain roads.

So, as stated before, it is their countries and I willingly adhere to their rules, just as we expect visitors to the U.S. to abide by ours.
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  #30  
Old 07-18-2013, 01:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K0m4 View Post
Lol, what a statement! First, same goes here. Second, it's kind of the same as a broken tail light or something of the sort: i.e. you're not going to jail for breaking this rule, you're getting a fine. Where I'm from (a different European country) we don't have those rules, but I live where they do, so I bought a kit and a vest. A kit which is a useful thing to have in any case.

I visited D.C. some months ago. Only place I saw so many cops was in Uzbekistan, which one can aruge is a police state. In the subway, there was this recorded messagve every ten minutes or so by a lady from Homeland Security urging people to report things that they thought was suspicious. It was a totally Orwellian experience, and it creeped me out - so cops can't search you, but the peer fear mongering is ripe. I'll have the old world ways any day, thank you very much.
I tend to take things personally, and laughing at Keith Falkner is not personally OK with me. I think it's rude. If you were near me, you would more greatly appreciate the power of the Constitution which protects you from having me teach you some politeness and manners. Keith is probably much more laid back than I -- but I'm going to recommend that you question the values of the culture that influenced your personality and permits you the freedom to go all Dave Letterman on a fine gentleman.
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